Guess the Weight of the Warsaw Grouper Shot the Day of the 2010 St. Pete Open

[SpearMax]

I am just poking a little fun here, so don't take it too seriously. :D :D

Please take the poll above and guess the weight of this warsaw grouper I speared on Saturday, August 21, 2010.

First, let me say congratulations to all the winners of the 2010 St. Pete Open! :notworthy

Anyone who comes in second place, third place or any place is not a "loser" in my book.

Especially, I congratulate the top-ranked winner Matt Joswig whose black grouper weighed 63 pounds.

Nice fish Matt! :toast:

Matt was the outgoing president of the SPUCs at the time of this year's SPO and a member of the 3 person Tournament Rules Committee.

Like some other east coast shooters, I was unhappy that the SPUCs changed the SPO rules at the last minute by disallowing warsaw grouper without telling the public until I called them out on it. Of course, everyone knows they did it for safety reasons. :rolleyes:

Anyway, enough of that venting, I am over the conflict. Competition motivates me. I think next year I will be hunting monster black groupers in the Gulf of Mexico at 60 feet deep and once again try my best to win the SPO fair and square. That prospect will probably give Howie some nightmares for the next year (just kidding Howie! LOL) :D :D

Back to the fish picture being polled. I decided to not enter this year's SPO, but went diving anyway as planned. My first dive was a deep wreck where there were no warsaws. :( My second dive produced this warsaw at a depth of about 180 feet. All diving was done with safety in mind. There were no trimix dives to 300 feet. I played by the rules of the SPO as if I was in the tournament just to see how I might have done. ;)

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=134979&stc=1&d=1282576529

[SpearMax]

Second, I would like to acknowledge a warsaw grouper that was taken to the weigh-in that was weighed on a certified scale. This beast was shot by Wade Hamlin and weighed 71 pounds. I had no idea he took his fish to the weigh-in and posed in front of the leaderboard until Saturday night when a friend called to tell me. Apparently, Wade created alot of buzz among the onlookers.

I spoke with Wade on the phone Sunday afternoon for the first time. Wade is the nicest of spearos and a good sport who had heard somewhere before he got the weigh-in that warsaw had been banned by the SPUCs over a week prior. He brought the fish in anyway as a "what if" scenario fully realizing it could not win because of the rule change.

Here is the story of that team's great day of hunting at this thread:

http://www.spearboard.com/showthread.php?t=110852

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=134981&stc=1&d=1282577590

Congratulations Wade on a super fish! :thumps:

[SpearMax]

Once again, I will reiterate that this thread is just for fun. :D :D

Please do not take it too seriously. :) :)

So, how many pounds do you think that warsaw weighs? Please take the poll and if you wish, also enter your best guess specific weight below. I will reveal the weight soon.

[scubajobert]

THE REAL ST.PETE OPEN WINNER.
when I saw that fish in your cooler that you brought to your hotel room, I was pissed that you weren't allowed to weigh it in. That's the west coasters biggest fear, that an east coast boy will beat them at there tournament.

[SkywayGray]

The Real St. Pete Open winner???????
A. He didn't enter, without entering, you CAN NOT win...
B. Rules said no Warsaws... So Again Can Not win with this...
C. I didn't see anyone crying about the new Pelagic category...

There are Rules to each tournament, so you PLAN ACCORDINGLY to those rules and you make a plan to win it...

An example was the southern open when they made Red Snapper its own category... CHANGE THE PLAN TO WIN THE TOURNAMENT!!

Maybe you should of gone after Big Carbos and none of this would have been an issue???

PS, If this is just for fun, Please DON"T erase my Post, or Ban me from the board.....

[chawk25]

Thats like catching a big Wahoo in a Kingfish tourney. BFD:lol:

[SpearMax]

THE REAL ST.PETE OPEN WINNER.
when I saw that fish in your cooler that you brought to your hotel room, I was pissed that you weren't allowed to weigh it in. That's the west coasters biggest fear, that an east coast boy will beat them at there tournament.

The Real St. Pete Open winner???????
A. He didn't enter, without entering, you CAN NOT win...
B. Rules said no Warsaws... So Again Can Not win with this...
C. I didn't see anyone crying about the new Pelagic category...

There are Rules to each tournament, so you PLAN ACCORDINGLY to those rules and you make a plan to win it...

An example was the southern open when they made Red Snapper its own category... CHANGE THE PLAN TO WIN THE TOURNAMENT!!

Maybe you should of gone after Big Carbos and none of this would have been an issue???

PS, If this is just for fun, Please DON"T erase my Post, or Ban me from the board.....

Calm down Skyway - Jobert was referring to Wade's fish. Wade was entered in the tournament, but he realized he could not weigh-in the warsaw because of the rule change. Jobert is just poking fun at the whole episode, I think :confused: :D :D

So, what is your best guess at the weight of my warsaw? :cowboy:

[ScottZeagle]

Nevermind...

[SpearMax]

If the shoe were on the other foot, would you laugh it off so easily??

I think not....

:cowboy:

Scott, we all have to lighten up a bit. ;)

If one of my tournaments did the same thing with the rules, I would expect some comments. :D :D

[SpearJunkie]

THE REAL ST.PETE OPEN WINNER.
when I saw that fish in your cooler that you brought to your hotel room, I was pissed that you weren't allowed to weigh it in. That's the west coasters biggest fear, that an east coast boy will beat them at there tournament.

You guys need to give it a rest already...

[diverlen]

THE REAL ST.PETE OPEN WINNER.
when I saw that fish in your cooler that you brought to your hotel room, I was pissed that you weren't allowed to weigh it in. That's the west coasters biggest fear, that an east coast boy will beat them at there tournament.

Jobert, I think you hit the nail on the head with this one. Too bad some guys just can't grow up and be a real man.

[SpearMax]

By the way, thanks for voting in the poll guys. :thumps:

[diverlen]

Tony, I'll take a swag at this one and say 89 pounds.

[SpearMax]

I do not recall Matt getting DQ'ed. You guys need to give it a rest already...

Matt clearly won under the rules, I am certainly not disputing that. But, I am really happy that I did not arrive at a weigh-in to find the rules had been changed a week prior. :eek: ;) :D

[scubajobert]

Thats like catching a big Wahoo in a Kingfish tourney. BFD:lol:

oh I'M SORRY A WARSAW IS NOT A GROUPER. IN A GROUPER TOURNAMENT
KING FISH, KING FISH TOURNAMENT. YOUR FISHING FOR KING FISH...........

[scubajobert]

you guys need to give it a rest already...

you know what i keep my mouth shut on a lot of shit butt this whole thing stinks.

[PrimeTime]

Its really sad to see the promoter of a tournament do nothing but poke and make fun of the "Worlds Largest Tournament" that has been around 45 years. This just shows everyone that you have no class what so ever and the reason that the once great SBO is dead.

By the way the 3 person tournament committee only votes on matters involving issues on tournament day. They do not make the tournament rules. The St. Pete Underwater Club does.

[scubajobert]

The Real St. Pete Open winner???????
A. He didn't enter, without entering, you CAN NOT win...
B. Rules said no Warsaws... So Again Can Not win with this...
C. I didn't see anyone crying about the new Pelagic category...

There are Rules to each tournament, so you PLAN ACCORDINGLY to those rules and you make a plan to win it...

An example was the southern open when they made Red Snapper its own category... CHANGE THE PLAN TO WIN THE TOURNAMENT!!

Maybe you should of gone after Big Carbos and none of this would have been an issue???

PS, If this is just for fun, Please DON"T erase my Post, or Ban me from the board.....

A he did enter. B THE RULES DID NOT SAY NO WARSAW THEY SAID NO WARSAW ON THERE VOTE FOR HAVING IT A RULE FOR 3 YEARS YOU WOULD THINK IT WOULD BE IN THE RULES ON PAPER... C the pelagic was added whats to bitch about.

[chawk25]

oh I'M SORRY A WARSAW IS NOT A GROUPER. IN A GROUPER TOURNAMENT
KING FISH, KING FISH TOURNAMENT. YOUR FISHING FOR KING FISH...........

Oh no im sorry because I really don't give a shit either way. Just saying that it doesn't matter what you weigh in if its not eligible for that particular tournament it aint going to win you shit. Wahoo----> kingfish tourney

[scubajobert]

Oh no im sorry because I really don't give a shit either way. Just saying that it doesn't matter what you weigh in if its not eligible for that particular tournament it aint going to win you shit. Wahoo----> kingfish tourney

then why post.

[chawk25]

then why post.

My bad didn't know this was your forum? Lo ciento

[Gamble]

I can understand people being upset, If I had potential winning fish a few miles off the beach I would be bothered also. I can also understand those choosing to remove Warsaw from the rules for safety reasons. Sure, shooting a Warsaw in 60-130ft of water isn't a safety concern in most cases but shooting one in 250+ sure as hell is. It's impossible to say it's ok on the east coast and not the west.

Most of the guys who went deep for blacks on the west side traveled VERY long distances by truck and water to target their fish. The east cost guys could have done the same.

Anyone who thinks this has anything to do with Capt. Ham-burglar or the SPUCS attempting to keep an east coast guy from taking top grouper is mistaken.

IMHO having Warsaw in the tourney would ruin it. Each year a handful of capable and experienced guys would go stupid deep and shoot GIANT Warsaw. A 100lb black or the Warsaw pictured above wouldn't even be close. If Warsaw HAD been in this year it would have had to been over 200lbs to get THIRD! The cost for a trip like that in the limited time would only decrease those competing for the top spot EVEN MORE. It would be a competition between less than a dozen guys and the east coast guys would be out anyway. Then the possibility of less experienced guys trying to dive, shoot and safety land a fish in the 200+ class in depths they have little to no experience in is a major concern. So to reiterate, having Warsaw would limit those able to win the top spot, endanger those that tried and the east coast guys would have to travel to the westcoast to compete.

Being a freediver, I don't really care specifically about the Grouper/Warsaw issue. But maybe I'll pull a GR and shoot a 100lb black in some of my 30ish stuff.
__________________

SpearMax, you forgot to add a "no one cares" choice to your pole.

[Mattedhead]

THE REAL ST.PETE OPEN WINNER.


Dude...the correct spelling is WHINER. I see how they are easily confused.

[ROCKHIND]

Just a question here, but if going deep(safety) was the concern, why not limit the tourney to recreational depths, or a not to exceed depth limit?

there are more than just big Warsaws down there.

[inletsurf]

oh I'M SORRY A WARSAW IS NOT A GROUPER. IN A GROUPER TOURNAMENT
KING FISH, KING FISH TOURNAMENT. YOUR FISHING FOR KING FISH...........

A jewfish is a grouper, could I show up to the SPO with a 350 lb jewfish and then proclaim myself the "REAL SPO GROUPER WINNER" and have you all respect me as such, just as I was getting hauled off to jail? :D


Tony, bravo, again you shot one of the dumbest fish in the water, and you act like its comparable to shooting a carbo of the same size. Rules are rules, maybe you should go run your own tournament if you don't like them. :D I agree with Scott, you're a little off keel with this issue the past few weeks. But hey, what do i know.

[scubajobert]

A jewfish is a grouper, could I show up to the SPO with a 350 lb jewfish and then proclaim myself the "REAL SPO GROUPER WINNER" and have you all respect me as such, just as I was getting hauled off to jail?

inlet id pay to see that.and you know what i mean about warsaw it's not on the endanger list.

[diverik]

They already make it as hard as possible on the east coast guys by captains meeting night before then weigh- in next evening. So some poor bastard on every team on the east coast was operating on about 1 hours sleep, and I hear safety is the concern. Sorry but I call bullshit here.

Given my observations over the years I would call this the GROGAN rule.
Rick

[RichT]

I'll make it simple and I'm trying to type really s-l-o-w so the "special" people can understand.
http://www.gulfcouncil.org/Beta/GMFMCWeb/downloads/rec_brochure_2010.pdf
Look on page 5 on the right hand side under "species".
Now, look at what is considered deepwater species and what grouper are considered shallow water species.
See it?

Now, imagine what a lawyer could do with that and some of you may finally understand...

[scubajobert]

A jewfish is a grouper, could I show up to the SPO with a 350 lb jewfish and then proclaim myself the "REAL SPO GROUPER WINNER" and have you all respect me as such, just as I was getting hauled off to jail? :D


Tony, bravo, again you shot one of the dumbest fish in the water, and you act like its comparable to shooting a carbo of the same size. Rules are rules, maybe you should go run your own tournament if you don't like them. :D I agree with Scott, you're a little off keel with this issue the past few weeks. But hey, what do i know.

Ive shot 100lb blacks and 100lb warsaws and to me they acted the same and died.

[inletsurf]

Ive shot 100lb blacks and 100lb warsaws and to me they acted the same and died.

Sure, the ones you shot did. I can buy that. My point was regarding to the difficulty in getting the shot between each species.

[ROCKHIND]

I'll make it simple and I'm trying to type really s-l-o-w so the "special" people can understand.
http://www.gulfcouncil.org/Beta/GMFMCWeb/downloads/rec_brochure_2010.pdf
Look on page 5 on the right hand side under "species".
Now, look at what is considered deepwater species and what grouper are considered shallow water species.
See it?

Now, imagine what a lawyer could do with that and some of you may finally understand...


Then why weren't "deep water species", and not just "Warsaw" excluded?

I'm just trying to make some sense of this soap opera.

[diverik]

This is what I call North Carolina Justice! LMAO:lol:

[B Lang]

They already make it as hard as possible on the east coast guys by captains meeting night before then weigh- in next evening. So some poor bastard on every team on the east coast was operating on about 1 hours sleep, and I hear safety is the concern. Sorry but I call bullshit here.

Given my observations over the years I would call this the GROGAN rule.
Rick

I will come to the defense of the west side guys on this one Rik. Would you rather drive 3 hours by car after the meeting ends go sleep on your own bed and get up at 5:30 and be on your spot at sunrise or leave the captains meeting, climb on the boat, then run 80-130+ miles (some years in rough ass weather) to your spot then sleep on a bean bag till the sun comes up. I think we have it pretty good if you ask me. We were still able to get 8 drops on 3 tanks running that profile described above.

[diverik]

So it is to even the playing field!:eek:

[RichT]

Then why weren't "deep water species", and not just "Warsaw" excluded?

I'm just trying to make some sense of this soap opera.


When the rule is written in the book, it will read precisely the way I have stated on several occasions.
There were a lot of things missing in the book this year including a full schedule of events.
Please keep in mind that there is a new crew of guys "managing" this event every year.
Hopefully, we can be perfect next year.

As it stands, we had the 3rd largest spearfishing event in recorded history.
People from as far away as Hawaii, California, and Louisianna attended.
Big fish were weighed in, everybody who attended partied and had a great time.
Despite this immature, petty bullshizt that Tony Grogan and his cronies try and promulgate, I will call that an overwhelming success.

[ROCKHIND]

When the rule is written in the book, it will read precisely the way I have stated on several occasions.
There were a lot of things missing in the book this year including a full schedule of events.
Please keep in mind that there is a new crew of guys "managing" this event every year.
Hopefully, we can be perfect next year.

As it stands, we had the 3rd largest spearfishing event in recorded history.
People from as far away as Hawaii, California, and Louisianna attended.
Big fish were weighed in, everybody who attended partied and had a great time.
Despite this immature, petty bullshizt that Tony Grogan and his cronies try and promulgate, I will call that an overwhelming success.

10-4:beer::beer::beer:

[SpearMax]

When the rule is written in the book, it will read precisely the way I have stated on several occasions.
There were a lot of things missing in the book this year including a full schedule of events.
Please keep in mind that there is a new crew of guys "managing" this event every year.
Hopefully, we can be perfect next year.

As it stands, we had the 3rd largest spearfishing event in recorded history.
People from as far away as Hawaii, California, and Louisianna attended.
Big fish were weighed in, everybody who attended partied and had a great time.
Despite this immature, petty bullshizt that Tony Grogan and his cronies try and promulgate, I will call that an overwhelming success.

How many years will it take your rule to get in the "Book" Rich? :rolleyes:

Just kidding - LOL :D :D :D

The SPO is a success - I do not question that Rich. I have competed in the SPO for a few years and really enjoy the event. It has been stagnant in attendance growth, but that does not matter to me. I like most of the people I see there and they are friendly in person. :cowboy:

In terms of sporting events in general, something with less than 300 contestants is not really all that significant in spite of the big egos involved. Think about it - does it really matter to most people other than those who keep crowing about it? :scratch:

Check out this guy's list:

http://www.topendsports.com/events/top100.htm


By the way, the voting is going well in the poll. If you have not done so - vote now and see the current tabulated results. :D

[Bottom Dweller]

How many years will it take your rule to get in the "Book" Rich? :rolleyes:

Just kidding - LOL :D :D :D

The SPO is a success - I do not question that Rich. I have competed in the SPO for a few years and really enjoy the event. It has been stagnant in attendance growth, but that does not matter to me. I like most of the people I see there and they are friendly in person. :cowboy:

In terms of sporting events in general, something with less than 300 contestants is not really all that significant in spite of the big egos involved. Think about it - does it really matter to most people other than those who keep crowing about it? :scratch:

Check out this guy's list:

http://www.topendsports.com/events/top100.htm


By the way, the voting is going well in the poll. If you have not done so - vote now and see the current tabulated results. :D

Hey Tony, isn't it better to be stagnant in growth with the biggest turnout of any tournament than rapidly declining in growth to the point of almost extinction like the Spear Wars series? :rolleyes: My guess is yes and that probably pisses you off to the point of being a constant pain in the ass, which is understandable.

[SpearMax]

Hey Tony, isn't it better to be stagnant in growth with the biggest turnout of any tournament than rapidly declining in growth to the point of almost extinction like the Spear Wars series? :rolleyes: My guess is yes and that probably pisses you off to the point of being a constant pain in the ass, which is understandable.

Welcome back Bottom Dweller. Brilliant point. :cowboy:

I am fine with the attendance at my tournaments. Everyone has fun and the prize table is killer. :thumps:

The per contestant prizes ratio is probably the highest in the world, but who cares? :scratch: :D :beer: :D

Scott, did you vote in the poll? You have a good eye for these things being a commercial guy.

Peace, Tony

[Bulit7]

Nice fish Tony.

A legal to take sportfish from the grouper category but removed from the allowable species list just when a wave of cold water came ashore in Florida bringing with it schools of these fish... Boy, what a fukin coincidence!! Dont take a brain surgeon. Had it been allowed, the fish above illustrates how things would have turned out.

Man up and admit it was a chickeshit move. Safety reasons my ass.

[SpearMax]

Scott, did you vote in the poll? You have a good eye for these things being a commercial guy.

Scott, still waiting for your learned opinion. :D

[SpearMax]

Man up and admit it was a chickeshit move. Safety reasons my ass.

Lee, that is wishful thinking. ;)

All they will do is continue to make vile personal attacks from the family-friendly,

sponsor-friendly safety of their toilet bowl inside the locker room. :rolleyes:

We passed 1,000 views on this thread in 12 hours from 11 am to 11pm.

Too funny! :D :D

[hogsniper]

All they will do is continue to make vile personal attacks from the family-friendly,

sponsor-friendly safety of their toilet bowl inside the locker room.

I resent that remark Tony, that was uncalled for.:lol: But seriously...here is your precious 2007 Warsaw mounted above my toilet, and it really is beautiful.
:thumps::cowboy::thumps:

[SpearMax]

I resent that remark Tony, that was uncalled for.:lol: But seriously...here is your precious 2007 Warsaw mounted above my toilet, and it really is beautiful.
:thumps::cowboy::thumps:

Howie, you are so classy. ;)

Please stop with your toilet humor.

It is way too funny! LOL :D

Here is my warsaw that made you cringe back then.

If I am a "loser" for coming in second place, is that how you also regard all the other "losers"?

I imagine you have never seen one under water. Or have you?

Lee's Taxidermy does such great work!

I have recommended Lee to many people.

Now, have you got your anger out of your system yet?

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135044&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135045&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135046&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135047&d=1282625238

[SpearMax]

Thanks for your PM Howie. We will have a meeting and take a vote. ;) :D

[Bulit7]

Howie, you are so classy. ;)

Please stop with your toilet humor.

It is way too funny! LOL :D

Here is my warsaw that made you cringe back then.

If I am a "loser" for coming in second place, is that how you also regard all the other "losers"?

I imagine you have never seen one under water. Or have you?

Lee's Taxidermy does such great work!

I have recommended Lee to many people.

Now, have you got your anger out of your system yet?



Nice "loosing" fish Tony. I wouldnt mind loosing with a fish like that!

[PropMan]

Howie, you are so classy. ;)

Please stop with your toilet humor.

It is way too funny! LOL :D

Here is my warsaw that made you cringe back then.

If I am a "loser" for coming in second place, is that how you also regard all the other "losers"?

I imagine you have never seen one under water. Or have you?

Lee's Taxidermy does such great work!

I have recommended Lee to many people.

Now, have you got your anger out of your system yet?

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135044&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135045&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135046&d=1282625238

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135047&d=1282625238

This is better than the Hattfield & McCoys ,having my morning coffee and
enjoying the glass houses being knocked down.
Its always great reading when Jobert gets involved ,this man knows his
sh!!.
I know ,lets start an underwater cage match,built your the ref.
my money is on Tony, especially if its a deep cage.

[Bulit7]

A jewfish is a grouper, could I show up to the SPO with a 350 lb jewfish and then proclaim myself the "REAL SPO GROUPER WINNER" and have you all respect me as such, just as I was getting hauled off to jail? :D


Tony, bravo, again you shot one of the dumbest fish in the water, and you act like its comparable to shooting a carbo of the same size. Rules are rules, maybe you should go run your own tournament if you don't like them. :D I agree with Scott, you're a little off keel with this issue the past few weeks. But hey, what do i know.

80 percent of the fish out there are stupid and swim right up to you. Thats a given and we all know that. The skitish ones are that way due to experience with divers.

The Real St. Pete Open winner???????
A. He didn't enter, without entering, you CAN NOT win...
B. Rules said no Warsaws... So Again Can Not win with this...
C. I didn't see anyone crying about the new Pelagic category...

There are Rules to each tournament, so you PLAN ACCORDINGLY to those rules and you make a plan to win it...

An example was the southern open when they made Red Snapper its own category... CHANGE THE PLAN TO WIN THE TOURNAMENT!!

Maybe you should of gone after Big Carbos and none of this would have been an issue???

PS, If this is just for fun, Please DON"T erase my Post, or Ban me from the board.....


You do not change the rules a week before the tournament based on fish reports in order to give the local shooters an advantage, lie about it and then lie some more. You all call Tony out for integrity issues and then pull a stunt like this. Please! Get a clue.:lol: "Safety concerns" HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!



You guys need to give it a rest already...

Yeah I agree. It is a tough pill to swallow. That right there would have been the winning fish. It is amazing to me how such a prestigious tournament could so compromise its integrity. This thread is a black eye for the SPO. It should be deleted.:rolleyes:

Thats like catching a big Wahoo in a Kingfish tourney. BFD:lol:

No, it would be like having a billfish tournament and due to a rivlary with the east coast and a recent saturation of, lets say swordfish, at the last minute, having a secret vote to ban swordfish and attribute it to a liability issue due to their unpredictable nature. Anyone entering a kingfish tournament clearly knows way ahead of time that only kingfish are allowed. This is a spearfishing tournament and warsaw is a legal sportfish. If the deep diving concerns were valid, your tournament would be concerned with depth and not fish. Dont be stupid and dont expect others to be so either. It is very easy to see thru the BULLSHIT.

[Bulit7]

This is better than the Hattfield & McCoys ,having my morning coffee and
enjoying the glass houses being knocked down.
Its always great reading when Jobert gets involved ,this man knows his
sh!!.
I know ,lets start an underwater cage match,built your the ref.
my money is on Tony, especially if its a deep cage.


Ref? Im in Tonys corner. These hypocrits can kiss my ass.:D

[SpearMax]

Howie and I are actually sending friendly PMs to each other now. :scratch:

I do apologize to Matt Joswig and Ken Jones for any angst they are suffering as a result of these Internet jousting matches.

Guys, I know you are good people and great spearos. :)

One thing you will not see me do is lash into Howie on a vile personal level. For me, that is not appropriate and shows a low level of maturity.

However, I might poke a little fun at him. :D :D

In fact, we had a meeting and secret votes were cast. The good news is that Howie won the 2010 Bloody Chicken Trophy as I promised would be presented near the end of this episode. :)

Now that is over, I have invited Howie Hogsniper to come spearing on my boat this weekend to hopefully see some warsaws for the first time for him. The offer is open and awaiting his decision.

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135049&stc=1&d=1282652803

[Bulit7]

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135049&stc=1&d=1282652803

:lol::lol::lol:

I like dat!!

[Mattedhead]

So let me get this straight...you shot a barely mediocre model of one of the easiest to approach fish in the ocean(~20% of their max size), and you are publically patting yourself on the back!?!?!? Your need to make yourself feel important is bordering on clinical.

The per contestant prizes ratio is probably the highest in the world, but who cares? As far as this goes...hahaha, we'll see next year. I think the underhanded manner in which you handled that this year will certainly be biting you in the ass next year.

BY THE WAY...how did it taste??? You did eat it right???:rolleyes:

[SkywayGray]

Rule Changes huh?? I didn't see any big deals when they made Red Snapper its own category in the Southern Open the night of the CAPTAINS MEETING...

I know the "Captains Meetings" aren't really a big deal for your tournaments, BUT that's where you find out about rules and ASK about rules you aren't sure on... If one would have been at the Captains Meeting, one would know to not shoot and bring a warsaw to the weigh ins..............

[SpearMax]

The per contestant prizes ratio is probably the highest in the world, but who cares?

As far as this goes...hahaha, we'll see next year. I think the underhanded manner in which you handled that this year will certainly be biting you in the ass next year.

Matt, you need to get a life dose of reality in the business world. There was nothing underhanded in asking commercial entities if they wanted to advertise on spearboard or in the tournament or both. If they choose not to, that is fine with me and I lose no sleep over the matter. :sleep:

In fact, one large sponsor who dropped out in a prior year came back this year. There has actually been a surge in marketing budget allocations towards the Internet, especially for venues with family-friendly content and lots of visitor traffic. This is happening even with the down economy. ;)

Howie and Chris were doing the same thing at the Blue Wild Expo. They were going around to potential sponsors and saying buy from us because our rates are so small compared to spearboard. All I have to say to the sponsors is yeah right -look at their traffic - you get what you pay for. :slap:

Matt, all the innuendo in the world that you spew is not changing the basic dynamic of the marketplace. Sorry to burst bubbles here, but Howie and Chris are chasing dollars just like everyone else. More power to them in the American way of free enterprise. :yay:

[Mattedhead]

Matt, you need to get a life dose of reality in the business world. There was nothing underhanded in asking commercial entities if they wanted to advertise on spearboard or in the tournament or both. If they choose not to, that is fine with me and I lose no sleep over the matter. In fact, one large sponsor who dropped out in a prior year came back this year. There has actually been a surge in marketing budget allocations towards the Internet, especially for venues with family-friendly content and lots of visitor traffic.

Howie and Chris were doing the same thing at the Blue Wild Expo. They were going around to potential sponsors and saying buy from us because our rates are so small compared to spearboard. All I have to say to the sponsors is yeah right -look at their traffic - you get what you pay for.

If that was what I was speaking of, I would follow your advice. So how was the Warsaw...Tasty?

[SpearMax]

If that was what I was speaking of, I would follow your advice. So how was the Warsaw...Tasty?

Damm tasty dude! The meat is solid white and firm. :thumps:

[inletsurf]

Put this up on the other board, but I know a number of members on Spearfishing Planet aren't welcome there.


Since it has been determined by Tony and others that I am a liar and a cheat, you will probably not believe what you are going to read. I thought about posting this earlier but was waiting for Tony's sources to inform him about why deep water grouper (warsaw) was removed from the SPO. Surprisingly, nobody bothered to look through the archives.

When this discussion was hot and heavy the SPUC was split about leaving it in or removing it. Then the following thread was posted after the 2007 SPO. This thread and the fact that others were talking about getting trimix cert to chase grouper at 300 ft plus put the final in the coffin

http://www.spearboard.com/showthread...ghlight=warsaw



"Am I going to die?" Roaming gnome goes deep.
Welcome to the SPO 2007!!!!

The only tourney I know of that a 47 pound (ungutted) grouper will get you 70th pick. But what the hell it is all in good fun.
We got a run out to a "wreck" that I had from some numbers out of a book of loran numbers that I have but did not confirm. A buddy of mine gave me a "confirmed" number to the same wreck and it was 393 feet from my loran so I believed it was there. The only problem is that this wreck is a little bit deeper than most you would want to dive (around 256 feet). I was told that this wreck was a tiny barge split in half and there was a resident Warsaw that went 200 to 250 on it. I really felt that if I got this fish I might get at least 3rd or 4th pick at the table(sarcasm). The only problem was that we could not find the wreck just a huge fish show. It was probably the only time a huge fish show was a problem but I wanted the lead to hit the correct spot because current was moving hard.
John and I got geared up with jacked lp 120's and several different pony bottles attached and with the might of giants we slung them up over our heads and strapped them on. uh...no....in reality I whined like a little bitch for some help and barely managed to pick my crap up and get it on the gunnels. Lucky us the current was going so hard we had the buoy dragging so we decided to "chase the lead to 250".

Jug goes over and "splash go the morons".

The first 40 to 50 feet the water was blue and warm, just like diving dreams then the MURKY water came. Oh F'ing great I am going to dive 250 in 5 foot vis! After another 20 feet it became clear to 80 to 100 feet of vis and REALLY COLD. As in my nuts must have receded so far into my body they were what were making my ears ache. Oh well the murk layer made it dark as hell and we are freezing our asses off in these skins and we are going to f'ing WIN! Or at least that was what I kept screaming to myself as I went on down. So we go down another 70 to 90 feet or so and we see the wreck from about 100. The little barge that could be turned into the 100 to 110 foot ocean going tug that was. Why the hell could my bottom machine not see this thing? Here is a tip: If you can see the gag from 100 feet above him and he looks big.....he is. Just a tip. The water being that dark had the gags looking very white with rusty bellies everywhere. I keep falling and lock onto a nice 5 foot model and whack him behind the eyes. He promptly hauled ass through a door ripping my shaft out of his head and good bye. Then I settled on the sand beside the tug. I look at my comp and I got me a whopping 1 minute till deco time. I should be able to get at least 5 fish! Umm.....yeah. I had just set a knee on the sand when out from under the wreck slides Mr. carbo. He is maybe not quite as big as the one I shot down in the keys but a hell of a lot bigger than the one I GOT down in the keys. There is a big difference between shot and got. I figure he might have gone 80+ pounds and he swims up to me 3 feet away and just sits there. Look away....stay cool....don’t look him in the eye....load slow.....you are just a big dumb fish.....WAIT!! did I just say big AND dumb.....aint no such thing. When I engaged my shaft and when he heard that little click someone came and put rocket boosters on that fish. I mean flew and never even turned once. Oh well maybe he went to the other side so I swim around the wreck looking for him or someone just like him smiling and waving at 30 pound gags. I am passing up 20 and 30 pound gags? Only the SPO. Well looky there after 5 minutes I have my first deco stop at 50 feet for 3 minutes. Check air, 1800 pounds....no sweat. Start to go up and hit 180 check air, 1100 pounds ....huh?....ok a little sweat. Make it up to first little hang at 100 feet, check air, 700 pounds....ok this is getting silly. Of course while we were coming up we had many 60+ jacks we could have shot but those wont get you crap in the SPO. I mean a 60 pound jack is not even worth a slipper lobster (more sarcasm). We did our hangs and got out of the water and I did not even have to go the bail bottle but we did do the scrubbing.

I handed up an empty stringer.

Lesson learned: Use a line shaft, and you can run out of air REAL damn quick at this depth. Be prepared and don’t do this shit if you are the LEAST bit uncomfortable.

The rest of the trip was pretty damn fun and we only dove numbers that we found while driving around in the elbow. I found a nice bait show that was about 2/10ths of a mile in radius and we stayed on it or near it and produced hogs to 18 pounds (YAY Chuck Schnur first place hog, and Jon Herrera second place hog). I found myself a nice mutton at 10 pounds and swam by several 20 pound gags and 10 to 12 pound hogs to get. Once again only in the SPO! And last but not least Keith, who is ok diving 158 feet but, 160, no way in hell, got his best gag. He swam up to the boat trying to be a coquet but when I looked over the side and could see the tail down by his fins I knew it was a damn fine gag (47 POUNDS). I think he wanted to take an anchor chain and wear the thing to work like a necklace he was so proud.

Damn fun Tourney, we killed a lot of fish, and no one got hurt.

Some one took some picture so put them up.



Here is the thread that Tony Spearmax refers to copying what Financial Advisor (hudgens) stated in the thread that Ken posted above (this was posted in 08/2007)

http://www.spearboard.com/showthread.php?t=50962


My grand plan was simple - Win the St. Pete Open by shooting a deep water Warsaw grouper in my back yard off Palm Beach Inlet on the east coast of Florida. As mentioned above, I have since learned that several other people like Chris Hudgens were working somewhat of the same plan in the Gulf of Mexico.

So here he is obviously FOLLOWING Hudgen's plan of shooting a deep water warsaw (not shallow water). The key point here is that Hudgens, Tony, and "Several others" were all equally putting theirselves at greater risk for a tournament.

Spearmax first started diving deep in 08/2007, as shown by his scamp harvest at 330' here, only months before he planned to shoot this big warsaw for the SPO:
http://www.spearboard.com/showthread.php?t=50735

Man, that sure isn't a whole lot of experience in diving for warsaw at 300+' depths is it? Get certified, shoot a 6 lb scamp and all of a sudden one is ready for the big game? In any case, he states in his own threads that others are making the same plans.

So obviously "warsaw fever" was going around, and people were obviously PUSHING their experience level for the tournament.

Allowing warsaw in the SPO would obviously increase liablilty, no ifs ands or buts. Tony in the thread above, along with many others, stated he was going very deep for a warsaw, and he wasn't the only one i.e. Hudgens and "several other people" in his own words.

Being faced with the influx of people seeking these extremely deep water fish, it was the club's decision to either accept whatever potential liability could be or be responsibe and reject it. Although I would love to contend for 1st place grouper out of my home port with a warsaw, I also understand their reasoning and rule and think it is extremely responsible.

Many people don't seem to get it: the SPUCs can easily come over and dive off sebastian and shoot a big warsaw off our deep wrecks if they wanted to, and blow their own record straight out of the water. They just seem to have the common sense NOT to.

[inletsurf]

There you go Tony, you called out "who" these individuals are, and you stated in your own thread that there were "SEVERAL" that you planned to follow, all pushing their experience levels to get a big warsaw. You weren't diving shallow, you had just got certified on trimix a month or two prior (you even have a photo of your new card in your thread), you proceeded directly to shoot a scamp at 330', which was the same month that you shot the warsaw that earned you 2nd place in the SPO, also shot deep.

Now explain to me how Hudgens, yourself and the others are not a liablity to anyone sponsoring a tournament when exhibiting and publically acknowledging such behavior?

[inletsurf]

FWIW I am not a SPUC, nor do I care to follow any club mentality. But it is obviously clear to me that if I were the SPO tournament, that I would also prefer not to allow warsaw to protect people who were too stupid for their own damn good, as well as my club from potential legal liability.

[SpearMax]

There you go Tony, you called out "who" these individuals are, and you stated in your own thread that there were "SEVERAL" that you planned to follow, all pushing their experience levels to get a big warsaw. You weren't diving shallow, you had just got certified on trimix a month or two prior (you even have a photo of your new card in your thread), you proceeded directly to shoot a scamp at 330', which was the same month that you shot the warsaw that earned you 2nd place in the SPO, also shot deep.

Now explain to me how Hudgens, yourself and the others are not a liablity to anyone sponsoring a tournament when exhibiting and publically acknowledging such behavior?

It is real simple Steve. I know about that Chris Hudgens thread and that the SPUCs considered banning warsaw a few years ago. I have a few SPUC insider friends that told me all about it. The vote did not pass back then, even with the trimix divers doing their thing for many species of fish.

The fishy thing this year is that warsaws are plentiful in shallower waters on the east coast and many big ones are landed. All of a sudden, the SPUCs ban warsaws and do not make it public? That smells. ::liar:

The issue is not about liability or safety. I say to you that the liability exposure is pretty much the same no matter what species is being targeted. Look at the waiver the SPUCs make you sign. Ask a lawyer my friend. :whistle:

If that was the issue, depth limits would be far more approriate as well as diving certification proof for the SPUCs to reduce any potential liability. But, then again, that might restrict their ability to bring in the big black groupers. They would not want to do that....duh! :rolleyes:

[inletsurf]

It is real simple Steve. I know about that Chris Hudgens thread and that the SPUCs considered banning warsaw a few years ago. I have a few SPUC insider friends that told me all about it. The vote did not pass back then, even with the trimix divers doing their thing for many species of fish.

The fishy thing this year is that warsaws are plentiful in shallower waters on the east coast and many big ones are landed. All of a sudden, the SPUCs ban warsaws and do not make it public? That smells.

The issue is not about liability or safety. I say to you that the liability exposure is pretty much the same no matter what species is being targeted. Look at the waiver the SPUCs make you sign. Ask a lawyer my friend.

1) You and the others were not targeting shallow water, you admit it and you continue to prove that regardless of what you say here and now.

2) A good lawyer can prove liability beyond the boundary of a waiver. You know this as well as any lawyer, to argue this point is moot.

3) Regardless of liability, are you saying that you'd host a tournament promoting unsafe spearfishing behavior like diving to 300 feet depths? Do you think that's a responsible thing to do as a tournament director?

4) You make this east coast vs. west coast, but do not understand that the SPUCs can just as easily dive a deep wreck off canaveral and land a 200 lb warsaw easily, if they wanted to break their own record. They choose not to because they have this thing called common sense. If you're such a good spearfisherman, why don't you haul the enterprise over to fort myers and find you a big carbo?

5) Why do you continue to imply that its a last minute change? Warsaw have been closed since 2008 and are voted on every year since. Here's a clue: there's a great possibilty that warsaw is also closed for 2011, from the tournament rules and possibly from the SAFMC. Will you make a big stink next year too?

[SpearMax]

1) You and the others were not targeting shallow water, you admit it and you continue to prove that regardless of what you say here and now.

2) A good lawyer can prove liability beyond the boundary of a waiver. You know this as well as any lawyer, to argue this point is moot.

3) Regardless of liability, are you saying that you'd host a tournament promoting unsafe spearfishing behavior like diving to 300 feet depths? Do you think that's a responsible thing to do as a tournament director?

I was typing this part and you missed it Steve (Mr. Quick Post - LOL)

If that was the issue, depth limits would be far more approriate as well as diving certification proof for the SPUCs to reduce any potential liability. But, then again, that might restrict their ability to bring in the big black groupers. They would not want to do that....duh! :rolleyes:

[Rolo]

I am very relieved to see the SPUC take such a prudent and responsible approach to safety. I fully support them in this decision. Moreover, it would be a terrible loss for a tragedy to fall upon such a pillar of the spearfishing community. I cringe just at the thought of a bad case of the bends or worse to strike any individual, much less one who possess all the benevolent qualities we all can hope to attain. Integrity, honesty and commitment to our sport via his poppouri of media outlets, including the most wonderful forum in the universe. Please be safe dude, spearfishing and life as it is won't be the same without you. Dive safe!

[SpearMax]

If you're such a good spearfisherman, why don't you haul the enterprise over to fort myers and find you a big carbo?

Good idea Steve! :thumps:

I have an outstanding captain over there who knows exactly where to find them.

Now the SPUCs will have an entire year of Wednesday night sessions to come up with a secret plan to reveal at the weigh-in or Captain's meeting next year for this nightmare scenario. Be careful Steve, they might blame you for planting the idea seed. :rolleyes: :D :D

[SpearMax]

I am very relieved to see the SPUC take such a prudent and responsible approach to safety. I fully support them in this decision. Moreover, it would be a terrible loss for a tragedy to fall upon such a pillar of the spearfishing community. I cringe just at the thought of a bad case of the bends or worse to strike any individual, much less one who possess all the benevolent qualities we all can hope to attain. Integrity, honesty and commitment to our sport via his poppouri of media outlets, including the most wonderful forum in the universe. Please be safe dude, spearfishing and life as it is won't be the same without you. Dive safe!

Thanks you Rolo for your wisdom. :D

[inletsurf]

I was typing this part and you missed it Steve (Mr. Quick Post - LOL)

They don't believe in the stupid polygraph/voice stress analysis bullshit like you do, so there's no good way to enforce that. Who wants to spend that kind of time and money other than you Tony? Its a tournament for personal enjoyment, not to worry about people hurting/killing themselves, and if they survive strap them to a galvanometer and EKG with some glorified security personnel acting like a CIA agent on the other end. Here's the weigh in line, here's the polygraph line. :rolleyes:

The answer here is simple: eliminate deep water grouper.

[inletsurf]

Good idea Steve! :thumps:

I have an outstanding captain over there who knows exactly where to find them.

Now the SPUCs will have an entire year of Wednesday night sessions to come up with a secret plan to reveal at the weigh-in or Captain's meeting next year for this nightmare scenario. Be careful Steve, they might blame you for planting the idea seed. :rolleyes: :D :D

Why not, Tony? I personally think you should do that. I thought I was clear about that with my remark that you should have taken Howie's offer and not pussing out like you did. I just can't stand to see you steamroll a friend of mine with your drama here, when you started it to begin with. I really do think the SPUCs deserve an apology for all of this online nonsense. That's all. If you have something to prove, then prove it following their rules and their game.

You give yourself too much attention...sure several of them may not like you but the majority don't know who you are, and if they did they wouldn't bother with you, let alone spend a years worth of wednesday nights planning on how to prevent you from competing in their tournament. Come on dude. You're just not worth the hassle. I'm not worth the hassle. Nobody is worth that kind of hassle. Seriously.

[SpearMax]

The answer here is simple: eliminate deep water grouper.

How about a Black Grouper found in deep water? Is that OK Steve? Is it safe?

[SpearMax]

Why not, Tony? I personally think you should do that. I thought I was clear about that with my remark that you should have taken Howie's offer and not pussing out like you did. I just can't stand to see you steamroll a friend of mine with your drama here, when you started it to begin with. I really do think the SPUCs deserve an apology for all of this online nonsense. That's all. If you have something to prove, then prove it following their rules and their game.

Steve, I did follow their rules after I "steamrolled" them to find out what the new rules were. :rolleyes: :D :D

It should not have been done that way and they have admitted it. ;)

Now back to the start of this thread:

I see you answered the poll Steve and I commend you for that.

The interesting thing is the answers are all over the map.

Let's get some more votes in. :bolt:

[inletsurf]

How about a Black Grouper found in deep water? Is that OK Steve? Is it safe?

Yes, a black can, and also a gag can be found in deep water. But it doesn't spend most of its time there like a warsaw. Most blacks shot in SW Florida are shot between 115 and 170 feet depths. You can go searching for a black or gag in 300', but it would be foolish as more reside shallower. Common sense dictates that. But more warsaw reside deeper than shallower than 200'. Since you can't protect people from themselves, and you cannot enforce depth rules, the best thing you can do is remove the incentive, in this case the warsaw.

You can continue to attempt to debate around the point of this rule, but it won't do much. You and a few others seem to be the only ones trying to wiggle around the reasoning and come up with your own agenda.

[inletsurf]

While we're being honest here, I want to know who the 6 dumbasses who believe that this fish is over 90 lbs are.

[SpearJunkie]

While we're being honest here, I want to know who the 6 dumbasses who believe that this fish is over 90 lbs are.

Bulit7, cksea, PropMan, sacha58, SeacraftSlinger, speargunhunter

Over 90 pound voters.....

[SkywayGray]

Good idea Steve! :thumps:

I have an outstanding captain over there who knows exactly where to find them.

Now the SPUCs will have an entire year of Wednesday night sessions to come up with a secret plan to reveal at the weigh-in or Captain's meeting next year for this nightmare scenario. Be careful Steve, they might blame you for planting the idea seed. :rolleyes: :D :D

FINALLY,
OK, So Someone save this post he just made. Next Year This guy is gonna win the St. Pete Open!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gamble]

I don't think ANYONE is taking into account the fact that adding Warsaw would destroy the tournament... Safe or not you guys can argue that till the end of time.

If Warsaw was added a handful of guys would be the only ones competing for the top spot. East coast guys would be forced to drive over to the the Gulf and compete if they wanted. The 30-40 guys who currently target big blacks would be cut to 12 or less targeting warsaw and a large part of the competition would be lost. Basically the tournament would go backwards......

The challenge of shooting a tournament winning fish would be more about depth than scouting, shooting and landing a challenging fish......Hmmmmm.

In addition, if Warsaw WAS in this years SPO, it would have taken a fish OVER 200lbs to get third at best and the top fish would have been shot off the west coast. So the argument that this had anything to do with Tony, anyone on the east coast, or large numbers of smaller Warsaw is pointless!!!!!

[Bulit7]

This thread is goin around in circles now. It should stand as a record of what was said and done. Let the community draw their own conclusions. A spearfishing tournament where tough guys are afraid of percieved liability towards one species but not towards deep diving as a whole. BULLSHIT. We all dive with computers. restrict the depth.

On the subject of polygraphs, why not? We need to weed out the lying, conyving scum. Perhaps the people that voted on these rules should take one to put all these ... "rumors" to rest.

Looks over 90 to me but whatever, great fish no matter what. Especially at 180 feet. Bravo.

[hogsniper]

Howie and Chris were doing the same thing at the Blue Wild Expo. They were going around to potential sponsors and saying buy from us because our rates are so small compared to spearboard.

Thanks for the award Tony, I'll expect it in the mail soon to go right beside my prized trophy from this weekend. We are finishing up on your Bloody Tampon Award as we speak.

Wow, that was really not smart to open up a brand new can of worms, but I'm glad you did. Let's do this...You left out the part where I was also explaining (within hearing distance of JFJF) that a former SB sponsor at the event had just shared with us that they donated thousands in product to you prior to the magazine folding and never got it back or any type of refund. :cowboy: You also left out the part where I told that particular sponsor that we would advertise his company for free because we respected all of the charity work he has done for others. What's the ROI on that type of business plan? You also left out the part where we DONATED $500 in merchandise to the raffle for Sheri, we didn't trade it for a booth, we happily DONATED it with nothing in return.

Our sponsorships helped us provide prizes for numerous charities, spearfishing tournaments, Key West Open, Southern Open, Blue Wild Expo, SPO, TBSC, Hell Divers, FRA, Rob Murphy, FSDA, etc, etc. What did SB send to any tournament/event other than the ones you own? Where do your sponsorship dollars actually go? Chris and I have never taken a dime or one piece of donated merchandise from the operation of the Planet, how is SB set up and who do you donate the profits to? We try to raise money so we can DO MORE, you raise money so you can MAKE more. Not that there is problem with you making a profit, I'm simply asking what portion of your profits go back to the sport or to help anyone, we donate 100%.

BTW, what does it cost for someone to answer a question about his own product on SB and how much is a banner ad running these days? Oh, and yes we are offering sponsorships for $100/mo, thank you for the plug.:thumps: Anyone that did not get what they paid for when sponsoring SB or SFM can advertise for free and anyone that got screwed out of a magazine subscription can get a free one from Spearing Magazine.

"All in good fun" eh buddy!:cowboy:

[diverik]

BY THE WAY...how did it taste??? You did eat it right???:rolleyes:

Wade(My friend) who shot the fish in question chopped that bitch up and fed all the people he wanted to. He wants nothing to do with this fight though.
Rick

[pantoja73]

there should be a bubble deepest inmertion category in the SPO so some can be happy. blow bubbles deep doen't make anyone a good spearfisherman. It only makes you good at that 'blow bubbles.'

[diverik]

I'm sure next year the rules will be clearly written. If changes are made 5 days before the tournement they will get posted on the respective boards. Not saved for a captains meeting supprise. Because as long as the rules are clear you can make any rule you want.
Rick

[kill shot]

Steve, I did follow their rules after I "steamrolled" them to find out what the new rules were. :rolleyes: :D :D

It should not have been done that way and they have admitted it. ;)

Now back to the start of this thread:

I see you answered the poll Steve and I commend you for that.

The interesting thing is the answers are all over the map.

Let's get some more votes in. :bolt:



Awe, typical that you would try to steamroll someone but if they tried that with you they get banned, talked shit about etc etc.

Then try to defer all the arguments by saying lets gets some more votes in on my fish that would have won. Well you didn't win and that is that. Big ****ing deal why make a big statement about it at the start of your post?

You obviously can't handle being called out on your own post without making it seem like someone else's fault.

Pretty unclassy on your part.

I would like to say if you want to ban me after these next few words then so be it. But you Tony are a piece of work(I'd like to say otherwise) and have never apologized for any wrong doing to anyone. I would say the same about the board but I like most everyone on here and that is the only reason I look here as I enjoy the community of everyone and what they contribute and the fact that I was lurking on here way before you owned it.


Last but not least, everyone make sure they vote.

Eric

[Flafishn]

I was with Wade when he shot this fish and we we in 80 feet of water. I knew the fish was not eligible for the tournament and really did not give a shit. I still dont. All I know is that my best friend and Dive partner shot his very personal best fish no matter what. If anyone thinks we took that fish to the tournament to start shit they are off base. We had to get to the Sunspree to weigh in after getting to the dock and loading the fish and getting them on the way.We had to change a flat on the side of 95 and take off the fender that was shredded that skin the rubber off the second tire and then made it to the weigh in line at almost 9 oclock. And after all the fish we weighed and the line was through we got the fish out of the room in a separate cooler and cleaned it and took one or two pictures of it. I dont know how they ended up with this picture but it was not to start schit.The fish had to be cleaned. It anyone looked at the fish they would have noticed it was not gutted. We never tried to weight the fish gutted.We weighed it on a 100 pound digital scale and it was 71.6 . Still the bottom line is the fish was my friends best fish of his diving career and we will never forget it.So not to fuel this Warsaw saga anymore . Good luck to all in the future and I hope you all have a good time trying to get something like this out of the sea.

[Mattedhead]

I'm gonna bow out now....this is ridiculous.



Tony-
I wish you all the luck with your tournaments. I'm sure they
will continue to be a success just like your magazine.














Ring a bell?

[B Lang]

:rofl: Heard about those. That is true character there.

[Ryfish]

I have no dog in this fight, but I find it so laughable that people are arguing over shooting fish on scuba and think it is some kind of challenge. Seeing girls shoot big fish (inc warsaw) just proves that any one can go out and do it. Watch the recent Sharktails Vid on the warsaw (which I like their vids alot) and the warsaw have little fear and even swim up to you. Also having speared on tanks it myself years ago ( I dove with a 65 year old that couldn't freedive any more and needed a dive partner) there is no challenge at all you do is wait for the fish to hole up and shoot away.

Now before any one goes and says these girls are great spearos.... yada yada. Yes they are and I think they need scuba to shoot fish and are good in their own right. But to have grown capable men arguing over shooting fish on scuba and who is better is a joke. When they are using scooters and lift bags its even a bigger joke...... Why not just get in a personal submarine and have fish seeking spears that shoot the fish for you.

Serious step back and look at the picture from a different angle.

Look at it this way its like comparing going out and hunting on public land on your own with a bow and taking on the animal one on one VS. going to a hunting preserve in Texas and having a guide drive you in the back of a pick-up truck pointing out the deer on a bait pile and you shooting it with a high powered gun. Which one is the hunter and which one is a shooter? Like I said not problem with it if you want some fresh meat, but don't brag and tell everyone your a big white hunter.

I also want to go on the record I have no problem with tank divers shooting fish if you want dinner, but do have a problem with grown capable men bragging about it like they are some kind of great spearo.

[Gamble]

I'm gonna bow out now....this is ridiculous.



Tony-
I wish you all the luck with your tournaments. I'm sure they
will continue to be a success just like your magazine.














Ring a bell?
:D:rofl::rofl::rofl::rules::wtf::whip:

I've received 5 calls from various BBO sponsors today........ VERY interesting stuff. Maybe I should start a poll!?

[sbh]

"Seeing girls shoot big fish (inc warsaw) just proves that any one can go out and do it"

New can of worms there...just when I think its about over it gets even better....keeping me occupied between patients last few days, thanks!

[hogsniper]

Tony-I wish you all the luck with your tournaments. I'm sure they will continue to be a success just like your magazine.

Ring a bell?

It was a highly respected former "good friend" of Tony's that got his arm twisted for a sponsorship and said that right after "no thank you, I only donate to non-profit or club based events". Once Tony was told no thank you, his tone changed dramatically as he scolded the ex-sponsor and threatened to remove all his posts if he didn't pay up. I actually have the entire email exchange if anyone would like to see it. All in good fun!:D

Doesn't really jive with Tony's recent post saying he doesn't care who sponsors or doesn't sponsor, he seemed pretty bent that this guy told him no and it's hard to believe anyone would be a dick to this sponsor. "You get what you pay for" and you get erased from SB when you don't pay at all.:cowboy:

[TheMackDaddy]

Yea I agree scuba is for cheaters if they are healthy males. Any dive community outside of your cheating little world of US scuba divers spearos would agree. You guys are living in an isolated fantasy world thinking that what you do is a challenge....look at how scuba speari-g is illegal everywhere....bc anybody can do it and clean house with no experience.

[diverlen]

:rofl: Heard about those. That is true character there.

Brandon, after reading all of these posts, my conclusion is that there are a lot of "characters" out there and they all know who they are.:D

[inletsurf]

Yea I agree scuba is for cheaters if they are healthy males. Any dive community outside of your cheating little world of US scuba divers spearos would agree. You guys are living in an isolated fantasy world thinking that what you do is a challenge....look at how scuba speari-g is illegal everywhere....bc anybody can do it and clean house with no experience.

Anybody can chum up the water and shoot fish with a float or reel attached, too. I've done it successfully, no big deal. When it comes down to it, I have always thought spearfishing is a pretty easy sport no matter what avenue you take. What I find hilarious is the typical freediver, like you, with your big ego and elitist attitude, cannot ever to seem to shoot a fish in the head. Big egos and ass shot fish. Welcome to freediving. We're the best, scuba sucks, center mass aim for the ass.

[Bulit7]

Dumb ass freediver comments. Any dipshit can catch fish on rod and reel with a beer in their hand, yet it is allowed and there even are competitions for that. Quit givin yourself so much credit. You aint all that. It boils down to personal prefference, budget, time on hand, local regulations and ego. Needless to say, I think we all got the fukin EGO part down. Dive on!

[Bulit7]

Anybody can chum up the water and shoot fish with a float or reel attached, too. I've done it successfully, no big deal. When it comes down to it, I have always thought spearfishing is a pretty easy sport no matter what avenue you take. What I find hilarious is the typical freediver, like you, with your big ego and elitist attitude, cannot ever to seem to shoot a fish in the head. Big egos and ass shot fish. Welcome to freediving. We're the best, scuba sucks, center mass aim for the ass.

OK, maybe we do agree on somethin!:beer:

Gotta give it to them last two, at least they can write and sound coherent in their self valor.

[Bulit7]

BTW, I think the hog huntin w/ dogs thread will be left in da dust by this one. I am here to help!!!

[inletsurf]

OK, maybe we do agree on somethin!:beer:

Gotta give it to them last two, at least they can write and sound coherent in their self valor.

Especially since they're typing with only one hand.

[Bulit7]

"Seeing girls shoot big fish (inc warsaw) just proves that any one can go out and do it"

New can of worms there...just when I think its about over it gets even better....keeping me occupied between patients last few days, thanks!

Hahahahah! No shit! This guy better have other options cause he aint scorin wit anyone on this board!! (unless him and his feedive buddies pull a high seas swicharoo!!!:lol:

pc post, btw.

[kill shot]

Still the bottom line is the fish was my friends best fish of his diving career and we will never forget it.


That is freaking awesome. This is what the sport is about!!!!

[pernicia]

I'm gonna bow out now....this is ridiculous.



Tony-
I wish you all the luck with your tournaments. I'm sure they
will continue to be a success just like your magazine.














Ring a bell?
:eek::lol:

[pernicia]

Yea I agree scuba is for cheaters if they are healthy males. Any dive community outside of your cheating little world of US scuba divers spearos would agree. You guys are living in an isolated fantasy world thinking that what you do is a challenge....look at how scuba speari-g is illegal everywhere....bc anybody can do it and clean house with no experience.

So go down to 300' and shot a Warsaw...and if you are man enough do it with no floatline and floats, no reels.


Anybody can chum up the water and shoot fish with a float or reel attached, too. I've done it successfully, no big deal. When it comes down to it, I have always thought spearfishing is a pretty easy sport no matter what avenue you take. What I find hilarious is the typical freediver, like you, with your big ego and elitist attitude, cannot ever to seem to shoot a fish in the head. Big egos and ass shot fish. Welcome to freediving. We're the best, scuba sucks, center mass aim for the ass.
:lol::lol::rofl:
I've done it too....pretty easy to jump on a school of 100s of Mahis, snorkel around, shoot a fish, and let the floatline do the work.

[jackpine savage]

How come there is no option for under 30 pounds?

[kill shot]

Yea I agree scuba is for cheaters if they are healthy males. Any dive community outside of your cheating little world of US scuba divers spearos would agree. You guys are living in an isolated fantasy world thinking that what you do is a challenge....look at how scuba speari-g is illegal everywhere....bc anybody can do it and clean house with no experience.

You should probably read Headhunters recent post on Blacks. Read the story about Moose's dive and then respond to this and tell us all that what they do takes no experience and anyone can do it.:rolleyes:
Please tell me that is an everyday experience and it's just part fantasy island.

[SpearMax]

Thanks for the award Tony, I'll expect it in the mail soon to go right beside my prized trophy from this weekend. We are finishing up on your Bloody Tampon Award as we speak.

Wow, that was really not smart to open up a brand new can of worms, but I'm glad you did. Let's do this...You left out the part where I was also explaining (within hearing distance of JFJF) that a former SB sponsor at the event had just shared with us that they donated thousands in product to you prior to the magazine folding and never got it back or any type of refund. :cowboy: You also left out the part where I told that particular sponsor that we would advertise his company for free because we respected all of the charity work he has done for others. What's the ROI on that type of business plan? You also left out the part where we DONATED $500 in merchandise to the raffle for Sheri, we didn't trade it for a booth, we happily DONATED it with nothing in return.

Our sponsorships helped us provide prizes for numerous charities, spearfishing tournaments, Key West Open, Southern Open, Blue Wild Expo, SPO, TBSC, Hell Divers, FRA, Rob Murphy, FSDA, etc, etc. What did SB send to any tournament/event other than the ones you own? Where do your sponsorship dollars actually go? Chris and I have never taken a dime or one piece of donated merchandise from the operation of the Planet, how is SB set up and who do you donate the profits to? We try to raise money so we can DO MORE, you raise money so you can MAKE more. Not that there is problem with you making a profit, I'm simply asking what portion of your profits go back to the sport or to help anyone, we donate 100%.

BTW, what does it cost for someone to answer a question about his own product on SB and how much is a banner ad running these days? Oh, and yes we are offering sponsorships for $100/mo, thank you for the plug.:thumps: Anyone that did not get what they paid for when sponsoring SB or SFM can advertise for free and anyone that got screwed out of a magazine subscription can get a free one from Spearing Magazine.

"All in good fun" eh buddy!:cowboy:

Howie, you need to start naming names. I do not know who you are talking about. I asked JFJF and he did not hear what you say. Your typical pattern is to make some vague innuendos without detailed fact statements so people think things are not the way they really are. You are fairly good at that type of deception. ;) :eek:

By the way, all the sponsor donations of prizes go on the prize table or wall for the benefit of the contestants.

Check out all the action here:

http://www.spearboard.com/forumdisplay.php?f=222

Everyone I talked to had a great time!

[SpearMax]

Still the bottom line is the fish was my friends best fish of his diving career and we will never forget it.

That is freaking awesome. This is what the sport is about!!!!

I agree :yup:

[Flafishn]

I have no dog in this fight, but I find it so laughable that people are arguing over shooting fish on scuba and think it is some kind of challenge. Seeing girls shoot big fish (inc warsaw) just proves that any one can go out and do it. Watch the recent Sharktails Vid on the warsaw (which I like their vids alot) and the warsaw have little fear and even swim up to you. Also having speared on tanks it myself years ago ( I dove with a 65 year old that couldn't freedive any more and needed a dive partner) there is no challenge at all you do is wait for the fish to hole up and shoot away.

Now before any one goes and says these girls are great spearos.... yada yada. Yes they are and I think they need scuba to shoot fish and are good in their own right. But to have grown capable men arguing over shooting fish on scuba and who is better is a joke. When they are using scooters and lift bags its even a bigger joke...... Why not just get in a personal submarine and have fish seeking spears that shoot the fish for you.

Serious step back and look at the picture from a different angle.

Look at it this way its like comparing going out and hunting on public land on your own with a bow and taking on the animal one on one VS. going to a hunting preserve in Texas and having a guide drive you in the back of a pick-up truck pointing out the deer on a bait pile and you shooting it with a high powered gun. Which one is the hunter and which one is a shooter? Like I said not problem with it if you want some fresh meat, but don't brag and tell everyone your a big white hunter.

I also want to go on the record I have no problem with tank divers shooting fish if you want dinner, but do have a problem with grown capable men bragging about it like they are some kind of great spearo.
I think you should speak with Headhunter and see if there any challenge to it. Sorry but you got a dog in it now.

[1shot2kills]

So go down to 300' and shot a Warsaw...and if you are man enough do it with no floatline and floats, no reels.



:lol::lol::rofl:
I've done it too....pretty easy to jump on a school of 100s of Mahis, snorkel around, shoot a fish, and let the floatline do the work.

you do know that blue water hunting is one thing..bottom hunting is completely different.I guess diving 60 70 80ft and laying on the bottom for a while seems "pretty easy" to you, or Virgilis 1000lbs tuna(blue water) was a piece of cake right...that was ignorant of you

[SpearMax]

I don't think ANYONE is taking into account the fact that adding Warsaw would destroy the tournament... Safe or not you guys can argue that till the end of time.

If Warsaw was added a handful of guys would be the only ones competing for the top spot. East coast guys would be forced to drive over to the the Gulf and compete if they wanted. The 30-40 guys who currently target big blacks would be cut to 12 or less targeting warsaw and a large part of the competition would be lost. Basically the tournament would go backwards......

The challenge of shooting a tournament winning fish would be more about depth than scouting, shooting and landing a challenging fish......Hmmmmm.

In addition, if Warsaw WAS in this years SPO, it would have taken a fish OVER 200lbs to get third at best and the top fish would have been shot off the west coast. So the argument that this had anything to do with Tony, anyone on the east coast, or large numbers of smaller Warsaw is pointless!!!!!

What the heck are you talking about Jeromy? :scratch:

Destroy the St. Pete Open? - Warsaw was in for decades until this year (we think) :crazy:

[Flafishn]

I agree :yup:
Thanks and I will rest my case.

[Louis Rossignol]

Tony, don't feel bad about the Warsaw rule change, I thought I could get these guys to put stingray on the board too, and it didn't happen. And I saw about 10 of them all around 80-100lbs.

Can anyone say, miscellaneous????

[waynewpb]

Pernicia. Obviously Freedivers are not diving 300 feet for Warsaw. That was a dumb ass comparison. What's with the reel comment. Scuba spearos on here have reels and every other boy scout gadget they can think of using. I dive with Ryfish and he doesn't have reels on his guns and either do I.
There was a recent thread of a woman on here who shot a big Warsaw. She told the story about how she watched the fish in a hole for while trying to figure out if it was a Warsaw. Once her partner confirmed she shot. Thought she missed, and then was told she didn't. Then obviously sent the fish up on a lift bag. What a joke. That's supposed to be a challenge. Floating there forever and watching a fish in it's hole. Not an option when Freediving. I have nothing against spearing with tanks. I have done it. But to have tournaments. That's just dumb. The winner is just the lucky person floating on the bottom and see's a big fish in it's hole. There is a reason it's illegal in every other country.

[hogsniper]

Howie, you need to start naming names. I do not know who you are talking about. I asked JFJF and he did not hear what you say. Your typical pattern is to make some vague innuendos without detailed fact statements so people think things are not the way they really are. You are fairly good at that type of deception. ;) :eek:

By the way, all the sponsor donations of prizes go on the prize table or wall for the benefit of the contestants.

Check out all the action here:

http://www.spearboard.com/forumdisplay.php?f=222

Everyone I talked to had a great time!

No need to drag an innocent sponsor into this, but you know what booth JFJF was working, whether he heard the discussion or not. I will be happy to pm you the complaining sponsor's name if you publicly agree to make him 100% whole if you left him hi&dry when you closed the magazine. Is it possible that there were so many paying sponsors left holding the bag that you really don't know who I'm referring to? Did you ever refund all those subscriptions that got shorted on SFM issues that never came? Businesses close all the time, I would just like to get a straight answer about how you made things right with the sponsors and subscribers that were supporting the magazine.

I have no doubt that you give all the prizes to your prize table, you have always prided yourself on that aspect of the tournaments and I hear that this year's prize table was very good. However, my question was what percentage of your profits/cash goes to charity, FRA, back to the sport, or to someone else's tournament? I'm curious what event other than your's that Spearboard sponsored in the past year. You mentioned we looked for sponsors at the Expo, I just want to distinguish the difference in what we do with our sponsorships as opposed to what Spearboard does.

I'm really interested in getting some straight up details to these frustrating questions as they are the primary reason why there are now two boards.

[TheMackDaddy]

So go down to 300' and shot a Warsaw...and if you are man enough do it with no floatline and floats, no reels.



:lol::lol::rofl:
I've done it too....pretty easy to jump on a school of 100s of Mahis, snorkel around, shoot a fish, and let the floatline do the work.

lets see some pics then?...you obviously don't know shit about bluewater spearfishing with a gay little hogfish in your picture and thinking that its as easy as going out there and chumming up. the real challenge of bluewater spearfishing is finding the fish. i bet my d!ck is bigger than the mahi you've shot. i spend hundreds of hours chumming and driving around, researching before I even see a fish to take a 20ft shot on in open water after diving up to 80 ft on a breathold. finding a fish in bluewater while diving is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. by the way i have shot some pretty nice fish as deep as you can tank dive on a breathold as well and that isn't all that easy


but keep telling yourself it is a challenge stay down with tanks at depths that only good freedivers can hunt and chase fish until they hole up

[waynewpb]

And Bulit did you really compare rod and reel to tank spearing. Rod and Reel is a challenge. You are the biggest moron on this board. You prove it time and time again.

[waynewpb]

Very well said Mackdaddy.

[hogsniper]

What the heck are you talking about Jeromy? :scratch:

Destroy the St. Pete Open? - Warsaw was in for decades until this year (we think) :crazy:

So you had decades to win with a Warsaw:sleep:, now that it's been out for a couple years:sleep: and all the sudden you had first place all wrapped up?:sleep: If it hadn't been for those meddling Spucs. :sleep:

[waynewpb]

And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.

[jackpine savage]

Wow, this is getting better and better.:cocktail:

[hogsniper]

And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.


:lol: Hahah, yeah Rok you backwoods fag!!:lol:

[inletsurf]

You know, we could be, say, in a lecture discussing dispersion theory in wideband fiber optic transmission and somebody, somewhere, will shout out "Scuba sucks, freediving is the real challenge...your a f*g rossignol!!!". Unbelievable.

[Bulit7]

You should probably read Headhunters recent post on Blacks. Read the story about Moose's dive and then respond to this and tell us all that what they do takes no experience and anyone can do it.:rolleyes:
Please tell me that is an everyday experience and it's just part fantasy island.

Yeah, any dumass could do it. Get real. It takes training, investment, gear, boat. This shit aint snorkeling. It takes training and commitment.

I think you should speak with Headhunter and see if there any challenge to it. Sorry but you got a dog in it now.

Yeah, and your dog is lame and magy and has been kicked in the ass.
:lol::lol:

you do know that blue water hunting is one thing..bottom hunting is completely different.I guess diving 60 70 80ft and laying on the bottom for a while seems "pretty easy" to you, or Virgilis 1000lbs tuna(blue water) was a piece of cake right...that was ignorant of you

Yes and if you analyze the numbers, you will notice that of all the freedivers here there is only a handfull that consistently produce great fish in good numbers and they are the guys that were blessed with a long breathhold. You can improve your breathhold to a certain degree but in general you cant go from a 45 second hold to a 2.5 minute hold thru training alone. If you do not have the correct metabolism or lung capacity, you are doomed to being a mediocre diver at best, albeit one that with enough persistence and exposure gets lucky and connects with good fish on occasion.

On the other hand, tank diving requires equipment, training and will. It is not as simple as some of you make it out to be. To many things can go wrong and when they do you die. There is a reason why insurance policies do not cover scuba, mountain climbing, sky diving and hang gliding. Per capita, they are the most dangerous sports there are.

Two different methodes to achieve the same objective but one methode can be developed thru equipment and a lot of training and the other you are either born with the physiologic capacity or not. You can better it some thru practice and training but that is about it. The rest are condemed to shootin small fish in shallow water.

In general, freedivers shoot less and smaller fish. Just look at the fish reports.

And for the record: I have done my share of both and still freedive when I can.

[pernicia]

you do know that blue water hunting is one thing..bottom hunting is completely different.I guess diving 60 70 80ft and laying on the bottom for a while seems "pretty easy" to you, or Virgilis 1000lbs tuna(blue water) was a piece of cake right...that was ignorant of you

That's like you guys telling that Dan M. 400 lbs grouper at 425' is a piece of cake.

[waynewpb]

You know, we could be, say, in a lecture discussing dispersion theory in wideband fiber optic transmission and somebody, somewhere, will shout out "Scuba sucks, freediving is the real challenge...your a f*g rossignol!!!". Unbelievable.

I don't think anyone said Scuba sucks. It was about what is more challenge. Rossignol is a Fag though.:thumps:

Good point and good post inletsurf. :thumps: Your bluewater theory along with pernacio is retarded though

[TheMackDaddy]

Yes and if you analyze the numbers, you will notice that of all the freedivers here there is only a handfull that consistently produce great fish in good numbers and they are the guys that were blessed with a long breathhold. You can improve your breathhold to a certain degree but in general you cant go from a 45 second hold to a 2.5 minute hold thru training alone.



In general, freedivers shoot less and smaller fish. Just look at the fish reports.[/QUOTE]


i hear this shit all the time from you...people aren't blessed as you say they worked and practiced for many years and trained very hard physically, they didn't smoke cigs and eat bacon and drink budweiser for breakfast everyday then sit on their fat-ass watching tv all day and strap on a tank and get nice fish in 100ft


yes freedivers get fewer and smaller fish because it is much harder!...thanks you for making my point bulit

[Bulit7]

You know, we could be, say, in a lecture discussing dispersion theory in wideband fiber optic transmission and somebody, somewhere, will shout out "Scuba sucks, freediving is the real challenge...your a f*g rossignol!!!". Unbelievable.

Its human nature man. When we put down others, it makes us better in our own minds. When one feels threatened by anothers percieved success, that is often the only recourse to appease the ego. To each his own. In the grand scheme of things its just someones self inflated opinion that only really matters to that person himself...

[inletsurf]

I don't think anyone said Scuba sucks. It was about what is more challenge. Rossignol is a Fag though.:thumps:

Good point and good post inletsurf. :thumps: Your bluewater theory along with pernacio is retarded though

Fine, I'm a tard I suck. Feel better? Good. Can we get off this derailing bullshit and back to the topic at hand? Its the first time the two forum owners have addressed each other publicly without name-calling or shutting each other down.

[pernicia]

lets see some pics then?...you obviously don't know shit about bluewater spearfishing with a gay little hogfish in your picture and thinking that its as easy as going out there and chumming up. the real challenge of bluewater spearfishing is finding the fish. i bet my d!ck is bigger than the mahi you've shot. i spend hundreds of hours chumming and driving around, researching before I even see a fish to take a 20ft shot on in open water after diving up to 80 ft on a breathold. finding a fish in bluewater while diving is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. by the way i have shot some pretty nice fish as deep as you can tank dive on a breathold as well and that isn't all that easy


but keep telling yourself it is a challenge stay down with tanks at depths that only good freedivers can hunt and chase fish until they hole up

I guess you have a really small dick, cause IMO they were small fish.

all that ego for diving to 80'?

you always post the same stupid comments. If I remember correctly, you posted on the famous "Tunnels" thread which was deleted that you were gonna report poachers to FWC to later say that you knew people who were selling fish with no Comm license (or giving them to Comm fisherman to sell for them)....I guess you not enough of a man to stand up since they are your friends.

[TheMackDaddy]

nah that wasn't me..get your facts straight. don't accuse me of shit i didn't do


and taking fish in 80ft is different than just diving to 80ft but you wouldn't know that because you always have a regulator in your mouth

[Bulit7]

i hear this shit all the time from you...people aren't blessed as you say they worked and practiced for many years and trained very hard physically, they didn't smoke cigs and eat bacon and drink budweiser for breakfast everyday then sit on their fat-ass watching tv all day and strap on a tank and get nice fish in 100ft


yes freedivers get fewer and smaller fish because it is much harder!...thanks you for making my point bulit

Some people just dont have the time to waste swimin around and tryin to get good at something. The objective is to fill the freezer and even though I love the ocean, when I go, I want to get fish. We could easilly use a rod and reel or deep drop but we chose tanks. Time is money and I dont have too much of either to waste.

Some people will never dive 80 plus depths no matter how much training and conditioning. Period.

Glad you feel so superior, but I cant help but wonder, why u feel the need to convince people that dont give a shit about it.

[pernicia]

nah that wasn't me..get your facts straight. don't accuse me of shit i didn't do


and taking fish in 80ft is different than just diving to 80ft but you wouldn't know that because you always have a regulator in your mouth

I know somebody that took a freediving class, and has been hunting to 70' in less than 2 months.

If it wasn't you, sorry. But I'm pretty sure it came from you.

I don't give a **** if somebody freedives or tank dives, people just need to respect the other. Both methods involve a lot of training. If I wanted to give you shit, I can compare you to European and Greek freedivers that hunt and dive consistently to 150',

[oto_gc]

Yeah, any dumass could do it. Get real. It takes training, investment, gear, boat. This shit aint snorkeling. It takes training and commitment.



Yeah, and your dog is lame and magy and has been kicked in the ass.
:lol::lol:



Yes and if you analyze the numbers, you will notice that of all the freedivers here there is only a handfull that consistently produce great fish in good numbers and they are the guys that were blessed with a long breathhold. You can improve your breathhold to a certain degree but in general you cant go from a 45 second hold to a 2.5 minute hold thru training alone. If you do not have the correct metabolism or lung capacity, you are doomed to being a mediocre diver at best, albeit one that with enough persistence and exposure gets lucky and connects with good fish on occasion.

On the other hand, tank diving requires equipment, training and will. It is not as simple as some of you make it out to be. To many things can go wrong and when they do you die. There is a reason why insurance policies do not cover scuba, mountain climbing, sky diving and hang gliding. Per capita, they are the most dangerous sports there are.

Two different methodes to achieve the same objective but one methode can be developed thru equipment and a lot of training and the other you are either born with the physiologic capacity or not. You can better it some thru practice and training but that is about it. The rest are condemed to shootin small fish in shallow water.

In general, freedivers shoot less and smaller fish. Just look at the fish reports.

And for the record: I have done my share of both and still freedive when I can.


this thread has made for some fine entertainment, Tony, as a public forum owner shouldn't you be trying to build new relationships? seems like your post is having the opposite effect, dude, you reap what you sow..


Lee, I went from 1' to 2:30 in 3 years with training and technique, it's all in your head. I think the decision to freedive vs scuba comes down to 2 things:

1-Skill
2-Motive

shooting a big fish freediving over 100' takes a set of skills that very few people have, so please refer to the factors above.

many freedivers aren't shooting big fish because they can't get to them, but most are content to get some fish for dinner or even at the prospect of just diving.

I understand a commercial diver having to shoot on scuba for big fish, and I can appreciate the experience and time it requires, but seeing a regular scuba guy go down 100'+ with a scooter to shoot a big grouper to compensate for the size of their small dick doesn't impress me at all. Not going to hate, do what you want, but nothing to brag about like your life was on the line.

[inletsurf]

Nevermind. I guess the mods should rename this thread "Scuba vs. Freediving, Part MCMLXXIV"

[Bulit7]

Oto, not everyone has the physiology to develop that capacity. You are one of the few on here that have succeded.

Guess there is no reason to brag about rod n reel fishin either but people do. Does that bother u also?

[waynewpb]

Nevermind. I guess the mods should rename this thread "Scuba vs. Freediving, Part MCMLXXIV"

Now that made me laugh. Your not a tard anymore. LOL

Oto gc. Was wondering when you were gonna chime in. Good to hear from you.

Bulit nobody on this board brags more than you. Don't be a hypocrite.

[SpearMax]

Tony, don't feel bad about the Warsaw rule change, I thought I could get these guys to put stingray on the board too, and it didn't happen. And I saw about 10 of them all around 80-100lbs.

Can anyone say, miscellaneous????

Louis, nice try with that one man!

One of my main issues is the SPUCs continuing this bogus story that they took warsaw away from the SPO years ago. Keep in mind they have been running this event for decades.

How did I win second place with a warsaw and go into their official records?

So, the exclusion of warsaw must have been AFTER that year. :slap:

I have talked to several people and confirmed there was no mention of it last year at the 2009 SPO. Ask Jobert for one.

We all know NOW that they NEVER changed the official rules. :rolleyes:

:rules: I know how these guys operate.

So, I wisely saved copies of the rules for the past two years and have attached them to this post.

Look at the dates on these files to verify what I am saying that I saved them on those dates right in front of each tourney.

Open the PDFs up and see if warsaw is excluded or even mentioned. :whistle:

It is important to note that somebody did change the fish list between these years 2009 and 2010.

[oto_gc]

Oto, not everyone has the physiology to develop that capacity. You are one of the few on here that have succeded.

Guess there is no reason to brag about rod n reel fishin either but people do. Does that bother u also?

you'd be surprised at what it takes to land a nice fish on rod and reel, not talking about deep dropping with electric reels. I don't hate at all. I've taken my best fish on rod and reel that I have not been able to top with any spearfishing kill, a 23lb mutton snapper (i have pictures to prove it!)

but it sure as hell feels good to take an 8lb mutton at 90'+!

[chasintail]

This thread is so awesome I read the whole thing while I was shittin.

[Bulit7]

Now that made me laugh. Your not a tard anymore. LOL

Oto gc. Was wondering when you were gonna chime in. Good to hear from you.

Bulit nobody on this board brags more than you. Don't be a hypocrite.
I do apologize for the name calling.

Seems that my "bragging" really gets to people with low self esteem. It only happens here.
It is funny that a lot of my buds on the hayabusa and sportbike boards actually like my posts and I enjoy theirs.
My theory is there are more angry bitches on here! :D Just a theory, though...

[scubajobert]

you'd be surprised at what it takes to land a nice fish on rod and reel, not talking about deep dropping with electric reels. I don't hate at all. I've taken my best fish on rod and reel that I have not been able to top with any spearfishing kill, a 23lb mutton snapper (i have pictures to prove it!)

but it sure as hell feels good to take an 8lb mutton at 90'+!

you can have that rod and reel after a couple of 50lb-70lb aj's I'm ready for a nap.

[Bulit7]

you'd be surprised at what it takes to land a nice fish on rod and reel, not talking about deep dropping with electric reels. I don't hate at all. I've taken my best fish on rod and reel that I have not been able to top with any spearfishing kill, a 23lb mutton snapper (i have pictures to prove it!)

but it sure as hell feels good to take an 8lb mutton at 90'+!

Im sure it does as it did for me to take quite a few lingcod at 80 in California. Now days I aint got time for that. I just want fish. To each his own.

I have plenty of rod and reel fish to my name. Just not my thing. I preffer divin.

[1shot2kills]

That's like you guys telling that Dan M. 400 lbs grouper at 425' is a piece of cake.

you guys? i never commented on that, i bet it must have been a pita to land...your comment is still ignorant though, if you dont think so go ask Chad Palan about how easy it must have been to land his warsaw.

[Bulit7]

my dik is bigger than yours. nananana!

[chasintail]

my dik is bigger than yours. nananana!


My dad can beat up your dad!

[Bulit7]

:thumps:

[Louis Rossignol]

And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.

Let's see this FAG's fish? So far all I see is an arrogant PUSSY. I can put my pic up with PRIDE,,,,,,,,BTW, Tony, mines bigger than yours.......:lol:

[Mattedhead]

As someone who only freedives, for the love of god...WaynePB and MackDaddy...STFU. You guys are giving all freedivers a bad name. Back to the original topic.

[scubajobert]

how deep Rok.

[Bulit7]

As someone who only freedives, for the love of god...WaynePB and MackDaddy...STFU. You guys are giving all freedivers a bad name. Back to the original topic.

:beer::beer::beer:

[Bulit7]

Let's see this FAG's fish? So far all I see is an arrogant PUSSY. I can put my pic up with PRIDE,,,,,,,,BTW, Tony, mines bigger than yours.......:lol:

Put up or shut up!:rolleyes:

I can count on one hand freedivers that can consistently shoot fish that big in this geographical area (GOM and SE Atlantic).

[Louis Rossignol]

Here's another one you ****in' Waynenewbe Pussy, where's yours biatch???

Suck on this one too................

[Louis Rossignol]

how deep Rok.

the deepest, dark, depths of Hell,,,,,, on Alu. 80's....

[kill shot]

And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.

**** I really wish spearboard was a face to face meeting place instead of a shithole to talk shit behind a screen.

Shit I would love to be in the room when this kind of shit gets said.

[Louis Rossignol]

**** I really wish spearboard was a face to face meeting place instead of a shithole to talk shit behind a screen.

Shit I would love to be in the room when this kind of shit gets said.

I luv you Man..........

[kmoose]

Two of the most pointless arguments on the board...... I want the last 20 minutes of my life refunded!

Freedivers......bubble blowers.... whatever.

In the late 70s Jim Hardy printed articles in the Miami Herald bashing us for skindive freeshafting in the Marquises. "Shooting fish in a Barrel" they called it.

I was raised skindiving in south Florida so I know a thing or two about breath hold freeshaft shooting and "leash hunting". Now I live on the other side of the fence and chuckle at thought of Whoboy schooling me on the validity of either.

I have been blessed enough to enjoyed many epic spearfishing experiences in both relms at their highest level. Neither overshadow the challenges presented by the other.

[waynewpb]

let's see this fag's fish? So far all i see is an arrogant pussy. I can put my pic up with pride,,,,,,,,btw, tony, mines bigger than yours.......:lol:


all on tanks> wow

[Louis Rossignol]

all on tanks> wow

OK, do you want to see my freediving shit PUSSY, also bigger than yours......

Put up or shut up.......

Join the hundred pound club, I'm a regular member.

[Louis Rossignol]

Do you really want me to show you all the Cuberas I've shot bigger than those in your avatar?

[waynewpb]

OK, do you want to see my freediving shit PUSSY, also bigger than yours......

Put up or shut up.......

Join the hundred pound club, I'm a regular member.


Seriously. You put up the slowest swimming freshwater fish alive for freediving. So you shot that in what? Ten feet of water. You are such a tool for that one.

You can put up all the cubes you want. They were all on tank. Don't count

[Louis Rossignol]

Seriously. You put up the slowest swimming freshwater fish alive for freediving. So you shot that in what? Ten feet of water. You are such a tool for that one.

Show me better.......... We're all waiting. You must blow Divefresh on a regular basis.

[kill shot]

Seriously. You put up the slowest swimming freshwater fish alive for freediving. So you shot that in what? Ten feet of water. You are such a tool for that one.

I love this shit.

We are still waiting to see your fish. If you are going to call someone out you might as well stick up for yourself!

[Louis Rossignol]

I'll take you on my boat, I wont show you my ass because I don't want you to think it's a target but I will then drop you off in the 1 1/2' viz I have when I shoot the beast, I want to see you have the balls to find him under the pilings/ cement pillars and shoot him. No floats!!!, we don't do that, we fight Mano' e Mano, cable to your gun, you lose? you lose your gun.

I'm gonna bring a little girl with me this Saturday, but she is a champion, not a faggot shit-talker like you. Go back to your hole, you ain't got shit on me, Boyeee.

[chasintail]

Go easy on him Rok. Its his first time.:lol:

[SpearMax]

No need to drag an innocent sponsor into this, but you know what booth JFJF was working, whether he heard the discussion or not. I will be happy to pm you the complaining sponsor's name if you publicly agree to make him 100% whole if you left him hi&dry when you closed the magazine. Is it possible that there were so many paying sponsors left holding the bag that you really don't know who I'm referring to? Did you ever refund all those subscriptions that got shorted on SFM issues that never came? Businesses close all the time, I would just like to get a straight answer about how you made things right with the sponsors and subscribers that were supporting the magazine.

I have no doubt that you give all the prizes to your prize table, you have always prided yourself on that aspect of the tournaments and I hear that this year's prize table was very good. However, my question was what percentage of your profits/cash goes to charity, FRA, back to the sport, or to someone else's tournament? I'm curious what event other than your's that Spearboard sponsored in the past year. You mentioned we looked for sponsors at the Expo, I just want to distinguish the difference in what we do with our sponsorships as opposed to what Spearboard does.

I'm really interested in getting some straight up details to these frustrating questions as they are the primary reason why there are now two boards.

Howie, you are the one doing the dragging here. :rolleyes:

In our sponsorship programs each year, there is mix of nine benefits a sponsor will get based on the level they come in at.

For example, in 2010, the levels are:

Diamond Sponsor = $7,000
Sapphire Sponsor = $5,000
Platinum Sponsor = $3,500
Gold Sponsor = $2,000
Silver Sponsor = $1,000
Bronze Sponsor = $500

This sort of matrix is common for most tournaments and websites I am aware of. There is nothing secret about all this.

Look here to see what I am talking about:

http://www.spearboard.com/forumdisplay.php?f=222

I have looked at the marketing programs for the last three years. The last time an ad in Spearfishing Magazine was one of the nine benefits was in 2008 and that was only at the highest levels of sponsorship. Any sponsor that actually was owed a print ad and did not get a print ad was given something else like an extra Internet ad value or a price reduction.

So, the obvious question to you Howie is this -

How is it that these sponsors keep renewing (and often increasing) their sponsorship in 2009 and 2010 if they were not happy with the resolution of prior periods?

Business just does not work that way Howie. If a sponsor is unhappy with their return on the investment, most will not keep doing it. They get a good marketing value with Spearboard and the tournaments - that's why sponsorships have been surging upward recently.

All prize donations go on the prize table/wall as I see you graciously have acknowledged. We raise money for the FRA and do alot of fish regulation and science activities to help preserve and protect the sport.

The Board is provided free to the public. Some sponsors pay cash instead of prizes, but most decide to pay with prizes. The tournament contestants get the prizes. We would never divert prizes to someone else's tournament if that is what you are saying you do above. Any cash is used to pay the cost of bandwidth and running the board. Someday maybe there will be a huge profit that I can retire on. My fingers are crossed Howie. Is there something wrong with that American capitalism free enterprise aspiration?

There you have it Howie. You can spin it all you want as some sort of greedy money-making machine, but that is not the truth.

Oh, one last thing Howie, when people requested refunds for their subscriptions to the mag, I sent checks to them. Once again, I extend that offer as I have in the past. Just send me a PM.

Peace Howie, Tony

PS - we were sponsors of the Blue Wild Expo this year.

[HurricaneBK]

So what did the warsaw actually weigh?

[Bill McIntyre]

So what did the warsaw actually weigh?

What Warsaw? Was this about a grouper?

[ROCKHIND]

And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.

Geez, I would really like to see you say that to his face tough guy!

so now this turned into SCUBA vs. freediving, this thread rules!

[ROCKHIND]

re-rail alert: what is the weight?

[SpearMax]

So what did the warsaw actually weigh?

We need Howie's vote added to the poll. ;) :D

[Bill McIntyre]

so now this turned into SCUBA vs. freediving, this thread rules!

All truly great threads do if they go on long enough. Its one of the constant over my 6 years on the board.

[ROCKHIND]

All truly great threads do if they go on long enough. Its one of the constant over my 6 years on the board.

True, I'd go back and see how many pages it took for it to start, but geesh! I guess it's all the same S#!t after about 6 pages.

[pernicia]

As someone who only freedives, for the love of god...WaynePB and MackDaddy...STFU. You guys are giving all freedivers a bad name. Back to the original topic.

:thumps::beer::beer:


I'll take you on my boat, I wont show you my ass because I don't want you to think it's a target but I will then drop you off in the 1 1/2' viz I have when I shoot the beast, I want to see you have the balls to find him under the pilings/ cement pillars and shoot him. No floats!!!, we don't do that, we fight Mano' e Mano, cable to your gun, you lose? you lose your gun.

I'm gonna bring a little girl with me this Saturday, but she is a champion, not a faggot shit-talker like you. Go back to your hole, you ain't got shit on me, Boyeee.
LOL,

Rok, he is the type of kid that got beat up in high school...the same idiots that won't stand up like real men when getting themselves in trouble.

[hogsniper]

We need Howie's vote added to the poll. ;) :D

I'm sorry, I missed the answer to the important question. What has Spearboard ever done for any other tournament or fundraiser other than it's own interests? Please be specific, no more vague references or ignoring this question. So far you bought a booth at the Blue Wild Expo on the list, you started strong, let's keep the list going. There must be something else you have done other than take your boat out in the name of "scientific research" on shark shields and diver propulsion systems.

And while I appreciate you allowing Mike at Florida Freedivers to do a ring toss at the event, I hardly think that qualifies as FRA support on your part.

So if a magazine sponsor donated product for magazine ads, and never recieved those ads, he simply got a banner ad to make up for it? Did they have an option for a refund? :cowboy:

[Rolo]

Everyone, please stop with the back and forth with the whole free versus scuba bullshit. That horse is as dead as Julius Ceasar. This thread is far more important now than sizing up each other's phallus. Please refrain from doing it on this thread and start another to address the topic if you will.

Tony,

Supporting the Koenigs was not supporting research. They have been enemies of our sport for a long time now. You always have an agenda and one can generally track it by following the money or your paranoic megalomania. Get real dude, how vain you are to think this rule change was all about you.

It's hypocritical to ask others to name names when you are the poster child for quoting off-hand "sources" , "insider friend" or "media contacts" blah, blah, blah:rolleyes:. Stay humble my friend because Pride comes before the Fall.

[diverlen]

I'm sorry, I missed the answer to the important question. What has Spearboard ever done for any other tournament or fundraiser other than it's own interests? Please be specific, no more vague references or ignoring this question. So far you bought a booth at the Blue Wild Expo on the list, you started strong, let's keep the list going. There must be something else you have done other than take your boat out in the name of "scientific research" on shark shields and diver propulsion systems.

And while I appreciate you allowing Mike at Florida Freedivers to do a ring toss at the event, I hardly think that qualifies as FRA support on your part.

So if a magazine sponsor donated product for magazine ads, and never recieved those ads, he simply got a banner ad to make up for it? Did they have an option for a refund? :cowboy:

Howie, without taking sides on this issue, please get control of yourself. You continually sound like an extremely disgruntled former associate. Don't you think you would be better off psychologically to move forward and not focus on old past issues. Overall, Spearboard is a well managed site and I think that is why spearos, regardless of style and background, are attracted to it. I know that is why I and my friends visit the site. Good luck to you in your future endeavors.

[smilinmatt]

To set the records straight about the woman who can't shoot a fish unless she's scuba diving. I had the pleasure to take her and her husband out on a spearfishing trip a few months back - freediving. I can safely say that she can out freedive most people that consider themselves "freedivers".

[waynewpb]

:thumps::beer::beer:



LOL,

Rok, he is the type of kid that got beat up in high school...the same idiots that won't stand up like real men when getting themselves in trouble.

Pernicia. I never called out anybody. Now you think I got beat up in high school. I don't agree with Rok's spearfishing, and I am allowed to express that if he wants to come on the Florida board where the stuff he does is illegal. If he thinks going out to an oil rig, strapping on a tank, and shooting big Tarpon swimming around him slow by the dozens is a challenge. Than let him think so. The croc hunter comment was because he shoots big rays.
I will say the same shit to people's faces. I'm not scared of anyone, so you can stop with all your theories.

[SpearMax]

I'm sorry, I missed the answer to the important question. What has Spearboard ever done for any other tournament or fundraiser other than it's own interests? Please be specific, no more vague references or ignoring this question. So far you bought a booth at the Blue Wild Expo on the list, you started strong, let's keep the list going. There must be something else you have done other than take your boat out in the name of "scientific research" on shark shields and diver propulsion systems.

And while I appreciate you allowing Mike at Florida Freedivers to do a ring toss at the event, I hardly think that qualifies as FRA support on your part.

So if a magazine sponsor donated product for magazine ads, and never recieved those ads, he simply got a banner ad to make up for it? Did they have an option for a refund? :cowboy:

Howie, your response is so tepid. In my previous long post, were those not the answers to your questions that you wanted to hear? Does my response not feed into your wild theories that Spearboard is out to control the universe? LOL :D

These additional follow-on questions are easy. :cowboy:

First, we do not divert the prizes sponsors donate to other tournaments. Doing so is unethical in my view unless a sponsor approves it. :(

Second, Mike at Florida Freedivers did not do the ring toss this year due to a prior committment. Denny and I were on the phone with Mike a few days before the event when I was over at his shop borrowing the ring toss board and rings. I had a volunteer run the ring toss and I provided the prize from my donations. To insinuate otherwise is just your usual inflamatory style. :rolleyes:

Sure Howie, I made amends with a couple of sponsors who were owed an ad and they could have gotten a refund. What is wrong with that? They are still advertising bigger and better. So what is your point? Are you somehow jelous of the advertising levels as you pursue exactly the same thing?

So now, here is a question for you Howie. :cowboy:

Why do you choose to attack me personally in your tiolet bowl locker room in the most vile of ways and allow others to do so? I don't do that to you. Does it make you feel like more of a man to do so?

[inletsurf]

Howie, without taking sides on this issue, please get control of yourself. You continually sound like an extremely disgruntled former associate. Don't you think you would be better off psychologically to move forward and not focus on old past issues. Overall, Spearboard is a well managed site and I think that is why spearos, regardless of style and background, are attracted to it. I know that is why I and my friends visit the site. Good luck to you in your future endeavors.

Really, so how did this whole warsaw drama start, was it Howie or was it Tony who was disgruntled that he couldn't shoot a warsaw for the tournament and posted up 2 threads worth of complaining?

Come on Len.

[diverlen]

Really, so how did this whole warsaw drama start, was it Howie or was it Tony who was disgruntled that he couldn't shoot a warsaw for the tournament and posted up 2 threads worth of complaining?

Come on Len.

Steve, I am not addressing how this issue started or didn't start. What I am saying is that it is better to be focusing on the future instead of the past. I also don't think that it is mentally healthy to be carrying around negative issues in one's head.
For myself, I don't focus on what someone else has done or is doing, I try to focus only on what I am doing to get the maximum out of life.
I also believe that one should never get excited about issues over which he has no control, only pursue those things over which he has control, life is too short.
Have a great day!!!

[SpearMax]

Really, so how did this whole warsaw drama start, was it Howie or was it Tony who was disgruntled that he couldn't shoot a warsaw for the tournament and posted up 2 threads worth of complaining?

Come on Len.

Steve, the drama was started by a vote by the SPUCs two Wednesdays before the event that was not made public until I asked. Thank goodness the east coast shooters found out before they got to the weigh-in.

Back to the weight guess, we need more votes so the poll can end. :cowboy:

[loose_cannon]

Pernicia. I never called out anybody. Now you think I got beat up in high school. I don't agree with Rok's spearfishing, and I am allowed to express that if he wants to come on the Florida board where the stuff he does is illegal. If he thinks going out to an oil rig, strapping on a tank, and shooting big Tarpon swimming around him slow by the dozens is a challenge. Than let him think so. The croc hunter comment was because he shoots big rays.
I will say the same shit to people's faces. I'm not scared of anyone, so you can stop with all your theories.

Dude,

Nobody really gives a damn what you agree or disagree with. Start your own thread and stop derailing this one, okay?

[sbh]

Steve, I am not addressing how this issue started or didn't start. What I am saying is that it is better to be focusing on the future instead of the past. I also don't think that it is mentally healthy to be carrying around negative issues in one's head.
For myself, I don't focus on what someone else has done or is doing, I try to focus only on what I am doing to get the maxim out of life.
I also believe that one should never get excited about issues over which he has no control, only pursue those things over which he has control, life is too short.
Have a great day!!!

:thumps:

[hogsniper]

Howie, without taking sides on this issue, please get control of yourself. You continually sound like an extremely disgruntled former associate. Don't you think you would be better off psychologically to move forward and not focus on old past issues. Overall, Spearboard is a well managed site and I think that is why spearos, regardless of style and background, are attracted to it. I know that is why I and my friends visit the site. Good luck to you in your future endeavors.

I know it's annoying Diverlen and I have refrained from pushing these issues for years, however I'm simply reacting to Tony's comments and disrespect of Spuc, SPO, and SFP. And while he calls for details, he refuses to provide his own or even straight answers to some very simple questions that are the very reason that SFP was created.

I'll let you guys get back to your juvenile freedive vs. scuba discussion now. BTW, these "elitist" freedivers in this thread should come have a beer at a Spuc meeting on any Wednesday nights in St. Pete. There they will find a group of world class, world record holder freedivers drinking and laughing with world class scuba guys. Many have been friends for decades and are actually relavent. Get over yourselves, many guys freedive and scuba and everyone thinks you're an idiot for feeling superior. Oh yeah, other countries don't allow scuba spearfishing because they can't manage their fisheries, the US is heavily managed by TAC regardless of the harvest method. :beer:

Sorry to derail your scuba vs. freedive thread Tony, now I know why you are avoiding my questions.

[inletsurf]

Why do you choose to attack me personally in your tiolet bowl locker room in the most vile of ways and allow others to do so? I don't do that to you. Does it make you feel like more of a man to do so?

You know, Tony, our toilet bowl locker room doesn't have freedivers ruining many scuba threads. We don't have the problematic people who shit on everyone's threads in the California section out of elitist egos. We don't ignore photos exceeding the policy limits, nor do we glorify spearfishing mortality (lost fish) like you guys do over here. We go through as much drama in one year as your forum does in 3-5 days. Rarely do we have drama, and rarely do we put up with problematic members. As I see it, we reject problematic members and they come over here to spearboard and continue to stir their shit with others. Sure, there are some who continue to voice their opinion of you, but guess what...you started this last week, you dished it out and kicked the hornets nest calling everyone related to the SPO "chicken shit", and now you're getting sensitive? Really? So you can attack people/groups at will over here keeping threads open against the user's will, but in a forum where you have no control to push the delete button or ban user button, all of sudden you're the victim of the bullshit you created? Did you not start all of this by incessantly calling the SPUCs "chicken shit", even after Howie offered you a free entry to the tournament?

Come on Tony.

[hogsniper]

Tony, I commend you for doing the FRA ring toss and donating the prize, first I have heard of that, thank you. So you bought a booth at the Blue Wild and raised $300 for the FRA.

So with all the mighty power of Spearboard, all your hits and users, all the threads and banner ads, all the huge returning sponsors... you raised $300 for someone other than yourself and gave nothing back to the sport? That's the question you continue to avoid or at least insist that you have already answered. I guess you not answering the question directly really is the answer...NOTHING. For someone that insists on details, you are awfully evasive. I'm gonna end my thoughts on this crazy thread with this final paragraph knowing that Tony will never give a straight answer anyway.

Who are you to question what we do, you are simply a guy that bought into the sport. You have built nothing, you have only ruined what was there. You have the support of no one, the respect of few, and have done practically zero to give back. You don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath with guys and tournaments you have been talking shit about for the past few days who have done more for the sport and others than you could ever imagine. These same guys with tears in their eyes to see Rob Murphy get the respect and admiration he deserves from a standing ovation at the awards ceremony. Not one person in that room giving one shit about you and your ****ing baby Warsaw you shot on Saturday. You have done nothing but take from the sport, talk shit about highly respected events and people, and done everything in your power to silence those that oppose your views. And the only thing that matters to you is website traffic.

I personally wanted to keep Deepwater Grouper in the tournament and was on the losing side(I'm sure your Spuc "spy" told you this), however after much convincing from my good friend Tony I will be making a motion to permanently remove all Deepwater Grouper species from all future SPO. They've never won anyway so who gives a shit.

I'll bet this whole Warsaw issue doesn't seem like a priority anymore does it Cowboy? All in good fun right Tony?

[ROCKHIND]

Pernicia. I never called out anybody. Now you think I got beat up in high school. I don't agree with Rok's spearfishing, and I am allowed to express that if he wants to come on the Florida board where the stuff he does is illegal. If he thinks going out to an oil rig, strapping on a tank, and shooting big Tarpon swimming around him slow by the dozens is a challenge. Than let him think so. The croc hunter comment was because he shoots big rays.
I will say the same shit to people's faces. I'm not scared of anyone, so you can stop with all your theories.

Of course you would.

[inletsurf]

And the only thing that matters to you is website traffic.

I'm going to take a guess that every month they have over 80,000 unique visitors, over 7 million page views, and over 25 million hits, including spam bot hits.

[normanhghntr]

This thread is nuts, i have just petitioned once again for the florida keys to be neither east or west coast, just south!, my New Key west open tournament has a new slogen, come one , come all, drink with me my friends!

[ScottZeagle]

Everyone, please stop with the back and forth with the whole free versus scuba bullshit. That horse is as dead as Julius Ceasar. This thread is far more important now than sizing up each other's phallus. Please refrain from doing it on this thread and start another to address the topic if you will.

Tony,

Supporting the Koenigs was not supporting research. They have been enemies of our sport for a long time now. You always have an agenda and one can generally track it by following the money or your paranoic megalomania. Get real dude, how vain you are to think this rule change was all about you.

It's hypocritical to ask others to name names when you are the poster child for quoting off-hand "sources" , "insider friend" or "media contacts" blah, blah, blah:rolleyes:. Stay humble my friend because Pride comes before the Fall.

Finally, a voice of reason.

:cowboy:

[SpearMax]

Tony, I commend you for doing the FRA ring toss and donating the prize, first I have heard of that, thank you. So you bought a booth at the Blue Wild and raised $300 for the FRA.

So with all the mighty power of Spearboard, all your hits and users, all the threads and banner ads, all the huge returning sponsors... you raised $300 for someone other than yourself and gave nothing back to the sport? That's the question you continue to avoid or at least insist that you have already answered. I guess you not answering the question directly really is the answer...NOTHING. For someone that insists on details, you are awfully evasive. I'm gonna end my thoughts on this crazy thread with this final paragraph knowing that Tony will never give a straight answer anyway.

Who are you to question what we do, you are simply a guy that bought into the sport. You have built nothing, you have only ruined what was there. You have the support of no one, the respect of few, and have done practically zero to give back. You don't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath with guys and tournaments you have been talking shit about for the past few days who have done more for the sport and others than you could ever imagine. These same guys with tears in their eyes to see Rob Murphy get the respect and admiration he deserves from a standing ovation at the awards ceremony. Not one person in that room giving one shit about you and your ****ing baby Warsaw you shot on Saturday. You have done nothing but take from the sport, talk shit about highly respected events and people, and done everything in your power to silence those that oppose your views. And the only thing that matters to you is website traffic.

I personally wanted to keep Deepwater Grouper in the tournament and was on the losing side(I'm sure your Spuc "spy" told you this), however after much convincing from my good friend Tony I will be making a motion to permanently remove all Deepwater Grouper species from all future SPO. They've never won anyway so who gives a shit.

I'll bet this whole Warsaw issue doesn't seem like a priority anymore does it Cowboy? All in good fun right Tony?

Howie, that is a pretty lame response. You are running out of steam in your smear Tony campaign, huh? :eek:

First I have respected the SPO and entered the event several times as you know. I was even a "loser" as you put it for coming in second place grouper one year. :rolleyes: I have provide a special section on this board for that event among many others. Ask Bret Walley about that one.

However, I do not respect the gamesmanship played this year by the leaders of the SPO. I continue to get PMs of support for my position that they tried their best to pull a fast one. The President of the SPUCs won top prize of best grouper and I do not dispute that fact. I never have claimed I would have won had the rules not been changed. Someone else might (I say might) have won had the rules not been changed.

When you do the following, when will you announce the results of the vote?

"I will be making a motion to permanently remove all Deepwater Grouper species from all future SPO. They've never won anyway so who gives a shit."

Concerning your parting comment as follows:

"I'll bet this whole Warsaw issue doesn't seem like a priority anymore does it Cowboy? All in good fun right Tony?"

I am glad you have been able to control your temper and respond in a pretty civil way. Perhaps, you are learning some lessons here. All in good fun, of course. ;) :D

[ScottZeagle]

As the old and wise Billy Mac said (and I paraphrase): This thread is like a trainwreck...and I can't help but keep watching!"

Personally, I am amazed that this thread has continued with no editing, removing posts, or bannings. Maybe the air can finally be cleared and people can move on with their lives. Although entertaining (or maybe heartbreaking) this thread and it's intentions are not good for the spearfishing community as a whole....in my opinion.

From a business standpoint, we cut back on tournament sponsorships this year...thus you will not see a Zeagle banner ad here, nor am I suppose to promote or talk about our products (as stated by Rule 11, or 15, or 22 or something??). To be honest, if the tournament was what it used to be (before all the Spear Wars/3 tournaments/1 East Coast tournament stuff) I would have done anything to make sure we supported it...but it is no longer the tournament that I loved and was proud to support.

Before anyone thinks I have a personal vendetta against Tony, we also didn't support the Hell Divers Rodeo this year, although I love those guys dearly, and would send them my own personal gear if they needed it...sometimes business decisions are tough.

Enough of my rambling...back to the battle royal!!!! :rolleyes:

[RichT]

Howie, that is a pretty lame response. You are running out of steam in your smear Tony campaign, huh? :eek:

First I have respected the SPO and entered the event several times as you know. I was even a "loser" as you put it for coming in second place grouper one year. :rolleyes: I have provide a special section on this board for that event among many others. Ask Bret Walley about that one.

However, I do not respect the gamesmanship played this year by the leaders of the SPO. I continue to get PMs of support for my position that they tried their best to pull a fast one. The President of the SPUCs won top prize of best grouper and I do not dispute that fact. I never have claimed I would have won had the rules not been changed. Someone else might (I say might) have won had the rules not been changed.

When you do the following, when will you announce the results of the vote?



Concerning your parting comment as follows:



I am glad you have been able to control your temper and respond in a pretty civil way. Perhaps, you are learning some lessons here. All in good fun, of course. ;) :D

Tony,


I'm going to call bullshizt on you and publicly challenge you to prove otherwise.
You continue to claim that some "inside" source told you it was some "secret vote" to dissallow Warsaw "this year" because of "You".

Thats not even close to the truth and I will publicly say that you, Tony Grogan, are either a lier or somebody is feeding you a bowl of crap that you are lapping up like a bowl of warm soup.

So which is it??

[pernicia]

Pernicia. I never called out anybody. Now you think I got beat up in high school. I don't agree with Rok's spearfishing, and I am allowed to express that if he wants to come on the Florida board where the stuff he does is illegal. If he thinks going out to an oil rig, strapping on a tank, and shooting big Tarpon swimming around him slow by the dozens is a challenge. Than let him think so. The croc hunter comment was because he shoots big rays.
I will say the same shit to people's faces. I'm not scared of anyone, so you can stop with all your theories.

1. You are allowed to express yourself without getting on a personal level and calling names.
2. He is not posting on the FL board, he is posting on the tournament board.
3. What he does is legal on his waters. Is like you telling divers in Hawaii they are illegally shooting parrotfish....it is legal in their waters.
4. Spearfishing on tanks is legal in FL, so live with it. ;)

And you say you never called names or call someone fag??, look at this...
And Rossignol. I can't wait until you go the way of the Croc hunter. Tarpon on tank. You backwoods fag.



sorry for the derail, but I had to address this guy.

[SkywayGray]

There is a reaon I do NOT talk shit on these boards.

1. Everyone is a "Computer Tough Guy" that just wants to beat up their Keyboards when they are typing.

2. Because people like, Most of the SPUCs and Many Others, have and will, consistently Out Shoot and out compete 90% of the others on this board. There is ALWAYS someone bigger and Badder than yourself on any given day.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is... Tony I've seen your posts on here where you dive deep and you look like a freakin astronaut to get to the bottom, only to come up Empty Handed or with a Scamp....... Just because you BOUGHT a spearfishing website, doesn't make you a Great Spearfisherman....
Go out with a Zacker, Dan, Tarr, or even Kirkonnel and see how "Good" you really are!!!! < I believe all hold RECORDS both locally and internationally, How many do you own?

If your only claim to fame is Diving Deep and shooting a Warsaw, then you need to get a freaking grip on this sport that you love and "Support"

[ROCKHIND]

There is a reaon I do NOT talk shit on these boards.

1. Everyone is a "Computer Tough Guy" that just wants to beat up their Keyboards when they are typing.

2. Because people like, Most of the SPUCs and Many Others, have and will, consistently Out Shoot and out compete 90% of the others on this board. There is ALWAYS someone bigger and Badder than yourself on any given day.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is... Tony I've seen your posts on here where you dive deep and you look like a freakin astronaut to get to the bottom, only to come up Empty Handed or with a Scamp....... Just because you BOUGHT a spearfishing website, doesn't make you a Great Spearfisherman....
Go out with a Zacker, Dan, Tarr, or even Kirkonnel and see how "Good" you really are!!!! < I believe all hold RECORDS both locally and internationally, How many do you own?

If your only claim to fame is Diving Deep and shooting a Warsaw, then you need to get a freaking grip on this sport that you love and "Support"


:lol::lol::lol:
In summary, "I do not talk shit.... but our di!(ks are bigger than yours"
that was funny!

[Gamble]

What the heck are you talking about Gamble? :scratch:

Destroy the St. Pete Open? - Warsaw was in for decades until this year (we think) :crazy:

The point is, no one has chosen to target them due to the cost and limited time available[ west coast]. If the word was out that people planed and scouted to shoot large Warsaw the other people with the experience and ability to dive those depths would have to do the same to compete. To be clear, when I say large I mean at least double the size of the one you shot. If that started a trend, more divers, experienced or not would be forced to attempt the same if they wanted to compete in the Grouper category. Finding Warsaw over here isn't an issue, shooting one obviously isn't an issue. Not killing yourself due to lack of experience[A] shooting a 200lb fish, Diving 200+, [C] diving 200+ and shooting a 200+lb fish [B]IS the issue.

No one bothered to target Warsaw on the west coast when they were part of the grouper category because they had a better opportunity to get a large black that would beat a east coast Warsaw in shallower water at less expense and on a shorter trip. Besides, they are dumb as a box of rocks and the ONLY challenge to shoot one is the dive profile.

If Jewfish weren't protected I don't think they should be in the tournament ether. Inexperienced guys would drop a shaft into a 400+lbr and loose his gear or get tangled in his mono and killed. More than likely this would happen in 80ft or less. Not take that same situation and add 150+ft of depth. It's simple not a good idea.

[SpearMax]

Before anyone thinks I have a personal vendetta against Tony, we also didn't support the Hell Divers Rodeo this year, although I love those guys dearly, and would send them my own personal gear if they needed it...sometimes business decisions are tough.

Enough of my rambling...back to the battle royal!!!! :rolleyes:

Scott, I am sure the Hell Divers still love Zeagle as do I. :thumps:

I recently sent you, Jim and Dennis an e-mail about a Zeagle query and will continue to do such things even if you did not sponsor this year. :cool:

When your business gets better, I would like to be considered again for a Zeagle sponsorship. :up:

As you know, I have to be fair to all sponsors and try my best to enforce our rules for those who do not sponsor, but try to market themselves anyway. I just signed up a brand new sponsor last night that had nothing at all to do with this current tournament debate. :)

[SpearMax]

Tony,


I'm going to call bullshizt on you and publicly challenge you to prove otherwise.
You continue to claim that some "inside" source told you it was some "secret vote" to dissallow Warsaw "this year" because of "You".

Thats not even close to the truth and I will publicly say that you, Tony Grogan, are either a lier or somebody is feeding you a bowl of crap that you are lapping up like a bowl of warm soup.

So which is it??


What is a "lier" Rich?

If you are going to call me names, please at least spell correctly.

The name you are calling me is "Liar."

I'm not sure I understand the post, after all that has been posted, are you now denying that a club meeting was held in which the written rules were ammended and that this change (which occured two wednesdays before the tournament) was NOT revealed in public and also that the club failed to update the written rules to reflect this FACT.

Are you denying that people outside the club were ONLY notified after I contacted Ken Jones (Big Pig) and specifically inquired if a "secret" rule change had been implemented and not announced?

Are you denying that this failure to disclose the rule change in a timely manner (i.e., immediately after the change was implemented) was questionable, unprofessional and could easily lead the disinterested observer to conclude that this was a concious decision and that there must have been some ulterior motive behind it?

And of course you do not deny that I almost won with my warsaw back a few years ago and that the written rules have NEVER been ammended to reflect that warsaws are excluded. I simply question why, year after year, you guys apparently "forget" to change the written rules.

I will not reveal where or how I first learned of this apparent deception because I made a promise to that SPUC. By the way, I do have some SPUC friends. My issue is with the SPUC leadership.

However, it would take a lot more to convince me and alot of observers of this conflict that the last minute exclusion of warsaw and the concealment of the rule change was not an unsportsman-like means to ensure that any of the warsaws that have recently become abundant (in relatively shallow water) due to an unusually strong and long duration upwelling event on the east coast was the real reason why the rule change was implemented.

So, I am a Liar, huh Rich? :rolleyes:

[Gamble]

Scott, I am sure the Hell Divers still love Zeagle as do I. :thumps:

I recently sent you, Jim and Dennis an e-mail about a Zeagle query and will continue to do such things even if you did not sponsor this year. :cool:

When your business gets better, I would like to be considered again for a Zeagle sponsorship. :up:

As you know, I have to be fair to all sponsors and try my best to enforce our rules for those who do not sponsor, but try to market themselves anyway. I just signed up a brand new sponsor last night that had nothing at all to do with this current tournament debate. :)


I think Scotts FB page sums up the chances of that happening.

Scott, if you don't mind explaining specifically why Zeagle no longer sponsors SB or the BBO tournament I'm sure members and Zeagle customers would have a better understanding of the business decision.

[ScottZeagle]

From a business standpoint, the bean counters insisted that we cut back this year....

I just made a list of the tournaments, and had to make some major cuts.

You guys wouldn't believe the amount of requests that we get for free stuff. Every tournament, underwater pumpkin carving contest, etc...it's pretty overwhelming.

Although I don't get out as much as I'd like, I still have a passion of spearfishing and have tried to support as many as I could...but this year I had to make some tough decisions, and being a west coast of FL guy, I obviously lean towards those tournaments.

I know that you want me to say that I am bitter about what I consider the destruction of the SpearBoard Open, Gamble...but I'm not gonna do that publicly.

[Gamble]

From a business standpoint, the bean counters insisted that we cut back this year....

I just made a list of the tournaments, and had to make some major cuts.

You guys wouldn't believe the amount of requests that we get for free stuff. Every tournament, underwater pumpkin carving contest, etc...it's pretty overwhelming.

Although I don't get out as much as I'd like, I still have a passion of spearfishing and have tried to support as many as I could...but this year I had to make some tough decisions, and being a west coast of FL guy, I obviously lean towards those tournaments.

I know that you want me to say that I am bitter about what I consider the destruction of the SpearBoard Open, Gamble...but I'm not gonna do that publicly.

Thanks Scott, Zeagle is lucky to have someone with your level of candor!:beer:

[SpearMax]

From a business standpoint, the bean counters insisted that we cut back this year....

I just made a list of the tournaments, and had to make some major cuts.

You guys wouldn't believe the amount of requests that we get for free stuff. Every tournament, underwater pumpkin carving contest, etc...it's pretty overwhelming.

Although I don't get out as much as I'd like, I still have a passion of spearfishing and have tried to support as many as I could...but this year I had to make some tough decisions, and being a west coast of FL guy, I obviously lean towards those tournaments.

I know that you want me to say that I am bitter about what I consider the destruction of the SpearBoard Open, Gamble...but I'm not gonna do that publicly.


Scott, you know the dive community has high respect for your products. The industry as a whole has been going through some tough times. I spoke with Dennis Bulin (the owner of Zeagle) and Jim W. (marketing guy) at the 2010 Blue Wild Expo and fully understand the Zeagle marketing decisions. I wish you guys well in this major recession. Thanks for your input on this thread. Tony

[kill shot]

Scott, I am sure the Hell Divers still love Zeagle as do I. :thumps:

I recently sent you, Jim and Dennis an e-mail about a Zeagle query and will continue to do such things even if you did not sponsor this year. :cool:

When your business gets better, I would like to be considered again for a Zeagle sponsorship. :up:

As you know, I have to be fair to all sponsors and try my best to enforce our rules for those who do not sponsor, but try to market themselves anyway. I just signed up a brand new sponsor last night that had nothing at all to do with this current tournament debate. :)

I think that if someone does not sponsor your board and then are not allowed to discuss their products on the board via threads etc is BS. What the hell is spearboard for then. Is it a business venture or is it a place for people to read about the sport they love? You just cut the throat of the guys who would most likely give you a sponsor in the future. Remember times are tough as Zeagle just said.



Just my .02, I'm sure you see it differently which is fine, its your website. Just thought we were all supposed to be brothers here.

[RichT]

What is a "lier" Rich?

If you are going to call me names, please at least spell correctly.

The name you are calling me is "Liar."

I'm not sure I understand the post, after all that has been posted, are you now denying that a club meeting was held in which the written rules were ammended and that this change (which occured two wednesdays before the tournament) was NOT revealed in public and also that the club failed to update the written rules to reflect this FACT.

Are you denying that people outside the club were ONLY notified after I contacted Ken Jones (Big Pig) and specifically inquired if a "secret" rule change had been implemented and not announced?

Are you denying that this failure to disclose the rule change in a timely manner (i.e., immediately after the change was implemented) was questionable, unprofessional and could easily lead the disinterested observer to conclude that this was a concious decision and that there must have been some ulterior motive behind it?

And of course you do not deny that I almost won with my warsaw back a few years ago and that the written rules have NEVER been ammended to reflect that warsaws are excluded. I simply question why, year after year, you guys apparently "forget" to change the written rules.

I will not reveal where or how I first learned of this apparent deception because I made a promise to that SPUC. By the way, I do have some SPUC friends. My issue is with the SPUC leadership.

However, it would take a lot more to convince me and alot of observers of this conflict that the last minute exclusion of warsaw and the concealment of the rule change was not an unsportsman-like means to ensure that any of the warsaws that have recently become abundant (in relatively shallow water) due to an unusually strong and long duration upwelling event on the east coast was the real reason why the rule change was implemented.

So, I am a Liar, huh Rich? :rolleyes:

Sorry for the spelling error in my haste to type. I will try to be more perfect.:sleep::rolleyes:

Yes Tony, It does finally prove that you are indeed a Liar.

If you really did talk to your secret little SPUC friend who attended that meeting in question you would know that...

A. There was absolutely no attempt at deception.

B. There was no mention of this upwelling on the East Coast. I think very few
SPUC's knew about it, including myself and I tend to read these boards on a fairly consistent basis albeit not much about East coast affairs.

C. NOBODY thought it was a big deal, at all, since there have only been 3 turned in, that I know of, in the last 13 years that I have been doing the tourny.
The club has literally hundreds of things to consider, that to us, are a far greater concern.

D. The deepwater grouper rule has indeed been discussed and voted on for the last 4 years.
SPUC counsel (lawyers) have recommended strongly from the first mention 4 years ago that we eliminate the deepwater species since our liability increases greatly by simply discussing it!
BTW... Its the deepwater grouper rule, not the Warsaw rule.
Further, deepwater grouper is defined by the National Marine Fisheries Service, not the SPUC.:rolleyes:


E. We admitted that we screwed up by not publishing the rule in a timely manner. But again, nobody in the the SPUC leadership thought it was a big deal!
We did post the rule on the boards as soon as we found out that it may upset some people.
IF we really wanted to screw you, Tony Grogan, Don't you think we would have waited to announce it at the captains meeting?!?

Finally, I believe the only "bad sportsmanship" here is from you, Tony Grogan.
I firmly believe you owe everyone in the SPUC organization an apology.

[Flafishn]

you can have that rod and reel after a couple of 50lb-70lb aj's I'm ready for a nap.
:lol: and a pain killer and a beer not necessarily in that order.One day Ill catch a big fish!

[Mattedhead]

What the hell is spearboard for then?

Profit it appears.

[Flafishn]

I'll take you on my boat, I wont show you my ass because I don't want you to think it's a target but I will then drop you off in the 1 1/2' viz I have when I shoot the beast, I want to see you have the balls to find him under the pilings/ cement pillars and shoot him. No floats!!!, we don't do that, we fight Mano' e Mano, cable to your gun, you lose? you lose your gun.

I'm gonna bring a little girl with me this Saturday, but she is a champion, not a faggot shit-talker like you. Go back to your hole, you ain't got shit on me, Boyeee.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::D

[B Lang]

:lol: and a pain killer and a beer not necessarily in that order.One day Ill catch a big fish!

Just don't do it like this. In Jobert's defense it was his 5th or 6th AJ in a row and the damn things were chewing the bottom of the boat off.
Amazing what this fun little thread has turned into. What I don't understand is why someone would think warsaw would have been allowed this year when it clearly has not been in a few years. We knew this a couple weeks ago or Jobert would not have shot a 75lber the weekend before. It is the SPUC's tournament and is geared toward west coast shooting.

[waynewpb]

[QUOTE=loose_cannon;1267699]Dude,

Nobody really gives a damn what you agree or disagree with. Start your own thread and stop derailing this one, okay?[/QUOTE

Shut your mouth old man

[Louis Rossignol]

From a business standpoint, the bean counters insisted that we cut back this year....

I just made a list of the tournaments, and had to make some major cuts.

You guys wouldn't believe the amount of requests that we get for free stuff. Every tournament, underwater pumpkin carving contest, etc...it's pretty overwhelming.

Although I don't get out as much as I'd like, I still have a passion of spearfishing and have tried to support as many as I could...but this year I had to make some tough decisions, and being a west coast of FL guy, I obviously lean towards those tournaments.

I know that you want me to say that I am bitter about what I consider the destruction of the SpearBoard Open, Gamble...but I'm not gonna do that publicly.

Scott,

the Hell Divers fully understand, and appreciate all you have done for us in the past.

Just for the record, your company wasn't the only one that told us, "because of tough times, we can't donate to your rodeo". I blame it all on Obama.

[Mattedhead]

Shut your mouth old man

Hopefully when the new wears off this sport for you, it will allow you to gain a big picture view of spearfishing. What you are doing now...aside from making an ass of yourself, is a huge disservice to this sport as a whole, whether it be freediving or scuba. You may choose to solely freedive and that is great, but you should show a bit more restraint in chastizing other divers who dive using other methods. A number of the guys you are talking down to have done more for this sport than you ever will and spent more time on the water than you can even imagine.

Oh and if you think that freediving 80' and shooting a fish is somehow more challenging than diving over 300' on air and shooting a large fish...you are in fantasy land. Being able to dive to 300' on air and even be able to tie your shoes at that depth is FAR more challenging than shooting a fish at 80' on a single breath...and FAR more dangerous. Hell, hunting fish at 80' while freediving is farm league $#!t...yet you and TMD seem to think it confirms you two as master spearos...give me a break. My wife was pulling the trigger at 60' last week in snorkeling fins after not having dove in 2.5 years...oh and it was her 5th time ever freediving. You guys are animals!!! :thumps:

Dive safe and please refrain from any further damaging remarks to the sport that we all love.

[Flafishn]

Its just good clean fun! Thats all!

[100days-a-year]

Really good to finally hear from a hetero freediver.Thanx Matt.

We as spearfishermen have enough issues without attacking each other.

[SkywayGray]

QUOTE=

Shut your mouth old man[/QUOTE]


Everyone is an internet tough guy... Don't beat up your keyboard over there while you self asphyxiating yourself......

[Mattedhead]

Really good to finally hear from a hetero freediver.Thanx Matt.

We as spearfishermen have enough issues without attacking each other.

Hell, I freedive because what you guys do scares the $#!t out of me. Plus, I'm not exactly built for lugging steel 120's around. :D

[TheMackDaddy]

Hopefully when the new wears off this sport for you, it will allow you to gain a big picture view of spearfishing. What you are doing now...aside from making an ass of yourself, is a huge disservice to this sport as a whole, whether it be freediving or scuba. You may choose to solely freedive and that is great, but you should show a bit more restraint in chastizing other divers who dive using other methods. A number of the guys you are talking down to have done more for this sport than you ever will and spent more time on the water than you can even imagine.

Oh and if you think that freediving 80' and shooting a fish is somehow more challenging than diving over 300' on air and shooting a large fish...you are in fantasy land. Being able to dive to 300' on air and even be able to tie your shoes at that depth is FAR more challenging than shooting a fish at 80' on a single breath...and FAR more dangerous. Hell, hunting fish at 80' while freediving is farm league $#!t...yet you and TMD seem to think it confirms you two as master spearos...give me a break. My wife was pulling the trigger at 60' last week in snorkeling fins after not having dove in 2.5 years...oh and it was her 5th time ever freediving. You guys are animals!!! :thumps:

Dive safe and please refrain from any further damaging remarks to the sport that we all love.

i wasn't going to post anymore but you can't seem to shut up about it so here goes

you are so programmed and defensive that you making up stuff in your head as you read my post

dude i never said that diving 300ft on air and shooting a 200lb fish was weak (i think those people have some balls)...i'm talking about the people scuba diving zipping around on scooters on the same wrecks at the same depths that I freedive raping every 12 inch hog and 24inch gag in sight....its just lame...its cheap as hell and yes i am jealous that they get more fish that they don't deserve...just like you conservative hicks are jealous of the people getting free hand outs from the government that you think they don't deserve because they aren't working as hard as you, think of it that way.

I never said i was a world class freediver...i'm not saying im some holy-badass so i don't know why your dumbass is putting words into my mouth, i simply stated a depth i hunt at, never said it was an amazing feat that nobody else in the world can do...i'm sure you and your wife can hunt at 100ft no problem...i'm just saying that what alot of people do on scuba is very lame.

[bag-man]

East West North South Tiger paw Eagle claw Power head Drunken monkey Warsaw Free diver I swear I'm getting confused.... There's an old kung fu movie on in the living room and I'm reading these threads. WTF I'm laughing so hard I can hardly type! You guys crack me up.....

[Mattedhead]

...i'm talking about the people scuba diving zipping around on scooters on the same wrecks at the same depths that I freedive raping every 12 inch hog and 24inch gag in sight....its just lame...its cheap as hell and yes i am jealous that they get more fish that they don't deserve...just like you conservative hicks are jealous of the people getting free hand outs from the government that you think they don't deserve because they aren't working as hard as you, think of it that way.

wow.:rolleyes:


Here I fixed it for you...please exclude the red italicised portion.:thumps:
just like you conservative hicks are jealous of the people getting free hand outs from the government that you think they don't deserve because they aren't working as hard as you, think of it that way.

Could you please state your qualifications for being in a position to call me a dumbass???

[pernicia]

Hopefully when the new wears off this sport for you, it will allow you to gain a big picture view of spearfishing. What you are doing now...aside from making an ass of yourself, is a huge disservice to this sport as a whole, whether it be freediving or scuba. You may choose to solely freedive and that is great, but you should show a bit more restraint in chastizing other divers who dive using other methods. A number of the guys you are talking down to have done more for this sport than you ever will and spent more time on the water than you can even imagine.

Oh and if you think that freediving 80' and shooting a fish is somehow more challenging than diving over 300' on air and shooting a large fish...you are in fantasy land. Being able to dive to 300' on air and even be able to tie your shoes at that depth is FAR more challenging than shooting a fish at 80' on a single breath...and FAR more dangerous. Hell, hunting fish at 80' while freediving is farm league $#!t...yet you and TMD seem to think it confirms you two as master spearos...give me a break. My wife was pulling the trigger at 60' last week in snorkeling fins after not having dove in 2.5 years...oh and it was her 5th time ever freediving. You guys are animals!!! :thumps:

Dive safe and please refrain from any further damaging remarks to the sport that we all love.

Thanks Matt, this is a contributing comment!.:beer::beer:

[pernicia]

i wasn't going to post anymore but you can't seem to shut up about it so here goes

you are so programmed and defensive that you making up stuff in your head as you read my post

dude i never said that diving 300ft on air and shooting a 200lb fish was weak (i think those people have some balls)...i'm talking about the people scuba diving zipping around on scooters on the same wrecks at the same depths that I freedive raping every 12 inch hog and 24inch gag in sight....its just lame...its cheap as hell and yes i am jealous that they get more fish that they don't deserve...just like you conservative hicks are jealous of the people getting free hand outs from the government that you think they don't deserve because they aren't working as hard as you, think of it that way.

I never said i was a world class freediver...i'm not saying im some holy-badass so i don't know why your dumbass is putting words into my mouth, i simply stated a depth i hunt at, never said it was an amazing feat that nobody else in the world can do...i'm sure you and your wife can hunt at 100ft no problem...i'm just saying that what alot of people do on scuba is very lame.

Dude, everytime there is a Scuba Vs Freedive thread, you are one of the first to come on bashing scuba divers.

Dive Safe:beer:

[Mattedhead]

dude i never said that diving 300ft on air and shooting a 200lb fish was weak

really?

Yea I agree scuba is for cheaters if they are healthy males. You guys are living in an isolated fantasy world thinking that what you do is a challenge....bc anybody can do it and clean house with no experience.

yep...sounds like you have mad respect for what they do!!!!:rolleyes:

[one shot]

Did I miss the actual weight?

[hogsniper]

"So with all the mighty power of Spearboard, all your hits and users, all the threads and banner ads, all the huge returning sponsors... you raised $300 for someone other than yourself and gave nothing back to the sport? That's the question you continue to avoid or at least insist that you have already answered. I guess you not answering the question directly really is the answer...NOTHING. For someone that insists on details, you are awfully evasive." Hogsniper

Did I miss your answer once again to the above question? And you call me vague and evasive.

All of your Deepwater grouper issues have been addressed at length whether you accept it or not. As far as the Spuc leadership, I know for a fact that 2 of the the 4 officers couldn't pick you out of a lineup and another is a Spearboard sponsor. Does that sound like a group of guys that plot against you? Now stop your smear campaign and move on or is the the post count so high you just can't stand to let it go?

For the record, I'm not running out of steam so if you want to continue airing it out let me know. To answer your question about reporting the club's decision, I have already stated my solution to resolve the issues at hand and I will get back to everyone as soon as I have the official decision about removing Deepwater Grouper from all future SPO. I have one vote, but plan to introduce the motion. As previously stated.. I agree that it's not been properly handled by the club and there is no reason to vote on this issue every year. It's either in or out from now on.

Now back to your official answer to my above post that you have been avoiding and deflecting for hours. Other than $300 for the FRA and buying a booth at the Blue Wild, what has Spearboard done for the sport, charity, or event other than one that you own? I still can't believe that you have all of this marketing power to sell to sponsors but you can't even get more than 80 people to come shoot a tournament with the "highest per shooter prize ratio" or whatever you called it.

Lastly, don't forget about the Blue Wild sponsor that I mentioned. You seem to have forgotten about him in your last few posts. Did you agree to honor your agreement with him within your magazine/tournament/forum advertising switcheroo gimmick post?

[inletsurf]

i wasn't going to post anymore but you can't seem to shut up about it so here goes

you are so programmed and defensive that you making up stuff in your head as you read my post

dude i never said that diving 300ft on air and shooting a 200lb fish was weak (i think those people have some balls)...i'm talking about the people scuba diving zipping around on scooters on the same wrecks at the same depths that I freedive raping every 12 inch hog and 24inch gag in sight....its just lame...its cheap as hell and yes i am jealous that they get more fish that they don't deserve...just like you conservative hicks are jealous of the people getting free hand outs from the government that you think they don't deserve because they aren't working as hard as you, think of it that way.

I never said i was a world class freediver...i'm not saying im some holy-badass so i don't know why your dumbass is putting words into my mouth, i simply stated a depth i hunt at, never said it was an amazing feat that nobody else in the world can do...i'm sure you and your wife can hunt at 100ft no problem...i'm just saying that what alot of people do on scuba is very lame.

blah blah blah blah :rolleyes: We got you point, 10 posts ago...scuba is lame. OK, roger that. You guys are ruthless when it comes to derailing threads over here. I have never seen anything like it.

[waynewpb]

Mackdaddy don't even bother anymore. They consistently put words in are mouths. Mattedhead doesn't even have a fish Avatar. They get on me and I never said anything bad about scuba spearos. I have done it. I just said I felt Freediving is more challenging. It's fun to shoot a big fish with tanks, but don't brag about it is what Ryfish originally posted. Anyone can do it. Pernicia why do you defend Rok. This guy shoots stuff just to kill and take pics. He obviously isn't eating the Tarpon. This is why I'm against him. Why would you defend a guy who disrespects the ocean. Trust me he would have drowned spearing the Cubes in my pic if he was even able to get down to hunt them. Everything I shoot I eat.

[normanhghntr]

you all think your so good , my stone crab style will beat your lobster claw any day, so bow down and call me master!

[waynewpb]

Big enough for you Rok

[ROCKHIND]

Big enough for you Rok

He must have died laughing his ass of at you.

SO.... Spearmax....What did the warsaw weigh?

[Louis Rossignol]

Big enough for you Rok

Yeah, that's big enough, give us the story.




Your hair is dry, your in clothes but in the water, lemme guess, rod n reel surf fishing, Waynenewb?

As far as me spearing Tarpon, you have no idea how the ocean works, and neither does NMFS. Kill them all on an even keel, don't just target edible species because if you do, that's the species that will be overfished.

Notice how the Jewfish over there are overpopulated?, same story here with Red Snappers. Because if this imbalance in our Gulf, other fish are suffering.

Kill them all on an even keel, and support your fellow spearos, there is strength in unity.

You came out calling me a faggot, I called you a pussy, you are no better than the enviros trying to shut us down. Good luck.

[waynewpb]

Seriously Rockhind. Get off my shit. I didn't say one thing to you and you keep commenting on me. I'm sure Lou can fight his own battles, so get off his shit also.

[Mattedhead]

Mattedhead doesn't even have a fish Avatar.

I enjoy shooting fish more than shooting pictures. At a certain point shooting pics of your fish takes a back seat to enjoying the adventure with your boys. This is about fun for me...not stoking my ego.

I invite you to come to NC and dive with us. We have a tournament every year in June...I will pay your entry fee, I will also help you with logistics (finding boat, lodging, etc). I think you will enjoy the format, it's freedive and scuba competing together...no separate categories. It typically attracts numerous national level divers, including world record holders, national champions, etc. Some of my best buddies from FL come up, friends from CA, and a bunch of good ole local boys. It's usually a 50/50 mix of divers but freedivers manage 80%+ of the awards. The local talent level may surprise you. If you are comfortable hunting at 80' you should do fairly well. Inshore is well within that depth. Pelagics are no problem...the tourney winning snapper and grouper will more than likely require 95'+ though, but a hail mary from 80' aka "death from above" may work on the shallower ledges.

I promise to be a good host and the boys are likable enough. Three days around that kind of group and it's hard not to learn something new. There are two pro photogs in the group and two of the best freedive videographers on the east coast. You will certainly have a disk full of hot new avatars and film clips when you return. If you only have a problem with Scuba divers that boast...then these guys are perfect for you. Most of us from that area don't spend much time posting photos or trip reports publicly (freedive or scuba). That may explain the lack of a "fishy" avatar on my part...then again, maybe I just can't shoot a fish. At the end of that weekend if you still need a more credible avatar from me you can take a pic of me holding one of your fish...I'll keep it up the rest of the year with a nod to you.

Rather than continuing to bicker and be negative, I'd like to make this a positive thing. There is far too much polarity between scuba/freedive, east coast/west coast, GOM/Atlantic....on SB. To the point SB should really stand for "Sand Box". I'd rather not try to convince you that your viewpoint is flawed over the internet, I would prefer the opportunity to show you otherwise through diving and hanging out with divers of all types from all areas...many who freedive and blow bubbles. I feel confident that at the end of the weekend you will view it all differently. Nearly all of us meet up for this tourney not to compete but to get together and share three days of adventures...the results are secondary...this is infectious and I hope helps alter your perspective. If you still haven't changed your mind I PROMISE we can find a few like minded souls for you to vent with!

I am very sincere in this offer. I believe we cleared the air well enough, and I harbor no ill feelings. If this does not work out, I extend the same courtesy for the SPO next year...though I will not be of much help finding you a boat. Maybe you can trailer your vessel from SFL. An added bonus would be that you could confront Louis in person as well as a few others you may have referenced earlier. Either way, consider your entry fees taken care of and the first few beers on me assuming you are over 21. Should be plenty of cameras around...Hopefully I will be able to take care of that avatar issue for you.

Shoot me a pm if you are interested...may be a little early to get the ball rolling scheduling wise, but I won't forget...this offer has no expiration.

[Bulit7]

Big enough for you Rok

What the fuk is that? This is Spearboard, not Rodboard.
If I'm "the biggest moron here" , you are top contender for second place. :thumps:

I enjoy shooting fish more than shooting pictures. At a certain point shooting pics of your fish takes a back seat to enjoying the adventure with your boys. This is about fun for me...not stoking my ego.

I invite you to come to NC and dive with us. We have a tournament every year in June...I will pay your entry fee, I will also help you with logistics (finding boat, lodging, etc). I think you will enjoy the format, it's freedive and scuba competing together...no separate categories. It typically attracts numerous national level divers, including world record holders, national champions, etc. Some of my best buddies from FL come up, friends from CA, and a bunch of good ole local boys. It's usually a 50/50 mix of divers but freedivers manage 80%+ of the awards. The local talent level may surprise you. If you are comfortable hunting at 80' you should do fairly well. Inshore is well within that depth. Pelagics are no problem...the tourney winning snapper and grouper will more than likely require 95'+ though, but a hail mary from 80' aka "death from above" may work on the shallower ledges.

I promise to be a good host and the boys are likable enough. Three days around that kind of group and it's hard not to learn something new. There are two pro photogs in the group and two of the best freedive videographers on the east coast. You will certainly have a disk full of hot new avatars and film clips when you return. If you only have a problem with Scuba divers that boast...then these guys are perfect for you. Those of us from that area don't spend much time posting photos or trip reports publicly (freedive or scuba). That may explain the lack of a "fishy" avatar on my part...then again, maybe I just can't shoot a fish. At the end of that weekend if you still need a more credible avatar from me you can take a pic of me holding one of your fish...I'll keep it up the rest of the year with a nod to you.

Rather than continuing to bicker and be negative, I'd rather to make this a positive thing. There is far too much polarity between scuba/freedive, east coast/west coast, GOM/Atlantic....on SB. To the point SB should really refer to "Sand Box". I'd rather not try to convince you that your viewpoint is flawed over the internet, rather I would like the opportunity to show you otherwise through diving and hanging out with divers of all types from all areas...many who freedive and blow bubbles. I feel confident that at the end of the weekend you will view it all differently. Nearly all of us meet up for this tourney not to compete but to get together and share three days of adventures...the results are secondary...this is infectious and I hope helps alter your perspective. If you still haven't changed your mind I PROMISE we can find a few like minded souls for you to vent with!

I am very sincere in this offer. I believe we cleared the air well enough, and I harbor no ill feelings. If this does not work out, I extend the same courtesy for the SPO next year...though I will not be of much help finding you a boat. Maybe you can trailer your vessel from SFL. An added bonus would be that you could confront Louis in person as well as a few others you may have referenced earlier. Either way, consider your entry fees taken care of and the first few beers on me assuming you are over 21. Should be plenty of cameras around...Hopefully I will be able to take care of that avatar issue for you.

Shoot me a pm if you are interested...may be a little early to get the ball rolling scheduling wise, but I won't forget...this offer has no expiration.

I like this guy more with each post!!!

.

[jackpine savage]

Mattedhead :toast::toast:Best post on this ever growing thread

[Louis Rossignol]

Mattedhead, great idea,

I'll buy Waynenewb a Hell Divers Rodeo ticket. Let's see how he fairs with a 30' murk layer and a rig leg to crack his head on after every big wave.:lol:

How bout is Wnewb??? I'll be a good host, but you better like to drink beer.

[waynewpb]

If that is your theory Rok I can respect that. I don't agree with it but everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Even though I don't agree with you I do apologize for the name calling. It doesn't solve anything. A more civil discussion would lead to a better thread. My beliefs are strong, and what you do makes me angry and that got the better of me.

I have been an avid Rod & Reel fisherman my entire life. Have caught many monsters and would love to show you more but main album was lost. Really sucks. Been stuck in the house with a new baby for three months, so hopefully some new monster pics soon.

You are correct. Shark was caught from the inlet and landed on the beach. Had to fight it against an outgoing tide using a 6/0 with only 40 lb test. Took three hours to land. I would say that's pretty skillful.
Do you have any Wahoo pics. Don't think many tank guys have gotten one. There's your next challenge if you haven't. Hopefully will get mine soon also.

Anyway best of luck to you also

[waynewpb]

Bulit just when I think your gone you pop up like a zit. That wasn't the point of the photo. Remember that next time you post your gun twirling, and so called hunting on here.
Anyway I'm tired of bickering with you also. Grouper Pooper calls us both Guidos, so we have that in common. From now on I think civil comments between us is in order.

[Bulit7]

Bulit just when I think your gone you pop up like a zit. That wasn't the point of the photo. Remember that next time you post your gun twirling, and so called hunting on here.
Anyway I'm tired of bickering with you also. Grouper Pooper calls us both Guidos, so we have that in common. From now on I think civil comments between us is in order.

:beer: Roger that!!

[Bulit7]

What the fuk. A perfectly good thread is turning... gay.:p

[waynewpb]

Mattedhead that sounds like fun. I think all my freedive buddies would enjoy that.

Rok I'm a Rum man. I'm not afraid of any challenge. I have a feeling you would be a good host, but then I'd end up gator food. :eek:

[headhunter561]

I enjoy shooting fish more than shooting pictures. At a certain point shooting pics of your fish takes a back seat to enjoying the adventure with your boys. This is about fun for me...not stoking my ego.

I invite you to come to NC and dive with us. We have a tournament every year in June...I will pay your entry fee, I will also help you with logistics (finding boat, lodging, etc). I think you will enjoy the format, it's freedive and scuba competing together...no separate categories. It typically attracts numerous national level divers, including world record holders, national champions, etc. Some of my best buddies from FL come up, friends from CA, and a bunch of good ole local boys. It's usually a 50/50 mix of divers but freedivers manage 80%+ of the awards. The local talent level may surprise you. If you are comfortable hunting at 80' you should do fairly well. Inshore is well within that depth. Pelagics are no problem...the tourney winning snapper and grouper will more than likely require 95'+ though, but a hail mary from 80' aka "death from above" may work on the shallower ledges.

I promise to be a good host and the boys are likable enough. Three days around that kind of group and it's hard not to learn something new. There are two pro photogs in the group and two of the best freedive videographers on the east coast. You will certainly have a disk full of hot new avatars and film clips when you return. If you only have a problem with Scuba divers that boast...then these guys are perfect for you. Those of us from that area don't spend much time posting photos or trip reports publicly (freedive or scuba). That may explain the lack of a "fishy" avatar on my part...then again, maybe I just can't shoot a fish. At the end of that weekend if you still need a more credible avatar from me you can take a pic of me holding one of your fish...I'll keep it up the rest of the year with a nod to you.

Rather than continuing to bicker and be negative, I'd rather to make this a positive thing. There is far too much polarity between scuba/freedive, east coast/west coast, GOM/Atlantic....on SB. To the point SB should really refer to "Sand Box". I'd rather not try to convince you that your viewpoint is flawed over the internet, rather I would like the opportunity to show you otherwise through diving and hanging out with divers of all types from all areas...many who freedive and blow bubbles. I feel confident that at the end of the weekend you will view it all differently. Nearly all of us meet up for this tourney not to compete but to get together and share three days of adventures...the results are secondary...this is infectious and I hope helps alter your perspective. If you still haven't changed your mind I PROMISE we can find a few like minded souls for you to vent with!

I am very sincere in this offer. I believe we cleared the air well enough, and I harbor no ill feelings. If this does not work out, I extend the same courtesy for the SPO next year...though I will not be of much help finding you a boat. Maybe you can trailer your vessel from SFL. An added bonus would be that you could confront Louis in person as well as a few others you may have referenced earlier. Either way, consider your entry fees taken care of and the first few beers on me assuming you are over 21. Should be plenty of cameras around...Hopefully I will be able to take care of that avatar issue for you.

Shoot me a pm if you are interested...may be a little early to get the ball rolling scheduling wise, but I won't forget...this offer has no expiration.


I agree this is the best post on this whole thread! we all love this sport regardless of whether we wear a tank, and most of the scuba and freedive crowd hold no animosity to eachother. Lots of us do both. Take him up on his offer Wayne, you just may get curious about the whole rest of the ocean beyond 100' and cross over to the dark side yourself. NC is amazing!!

[SpearMax]

"So with all the mighty power of Spearboard, all your hits and users, all the threads and banner ads, all the huge returning sponsors... you raised $300 for someone other than yourself and gave nothing back to the sport? That's the question you continue to avoid or at least insist that you have already answered. I guess you not answering the question directly really is the answer...NOTHING. For someone that insists on details, you are awfully evasive." Hogsniper

Did I miss your answer once again to the above question? And you call me vague and evasive.

All of your Deepwater grouper issues have been addressed at length whether you accept it or not. As far as the Spuc leadership, I know for a fact that 2 of the the 4 officers couldn't pick you out of a lineup and another is a Spearboard sponsor. Does that sound like a group of guys that plot against you? Now stop your smear campaign and move on or is the the post count so high you just can't stand to let it go?

For the record, I'm not running out of steam so if you want to continue airing it out let me know. To answer your question about reporting the club's decision, I have already stated my solution to resolve the issues at hand and I will get back to everyone as soon as I have the official decision about removing Deepwater Grouper from all future SPO. I have one vote, but plan to introduce the motion. As previously stated.. I agree that it's not been properly handled by the club and there is no reason to vote on this issue every year. It's either in or out from now on.

Now back to your official answer to my above post that you have been avoiding and deflecting for hours. Other than $300 for the FRA and buying a booth at the Blue Wild, what has Spearboard done for the sport, charity, or event other than one that you own? I still can't believe that you have all of this marketing power to sell to sponsors but you can't even get more than 80 people to come shoot a tournament with the "highest per shooter prize ratio" or whatever you called it.

Lastly, don't forget about the Blue Wild sponsor that I mentioned. You seem to have forgotten about him in your last few posts. Did you agree to honor your agreement with him within your magazine/tournament/forum advertising switcheroo gimmick post?

Howie, I hate to burst your ego bubble man.

I work and spend money on plenty of projects to preserve and protect this sport that you may not realize. I have no obligation to account to your truth-twisting persona on the Internet. Who the heck are you anyway?

Ooo eee....... look at me - I am Howie the Hogsniper - doing so much, so much, so much, so much that nobody is going to believe me unless I state it every 15 minutes. I love lists of my accomplishments posted everywhere. :sleep:

So, let me spell it out to you Howie in actions instead of the balderdash, effusive carping you seem to be the resident expert in shovelling out from your keyboard. :D

Here is a real world example of the sort of thing I get involved in regularly.

Today, I was contacted by two people on a very urgent matter to defend the sport of spearfishing. The first person in Tallahassee made me aware of a movement afoot to counter-act tremendous progress made by the spearfishing community on a regulatory matter. The second person who called me today was FRA president Denny O'Hern (your fellow SPUC) to discuss at length the issue brought up by the first person and to strategize a coordinated response from the spearfishing community. Denny and I agree to work together on this effort that will be announced in the next day or two.

If I am so insignificant in your book Howie, why would important people in Tallahassee suggest I be a spokesperson once again for the sport? :scratch:

Why would Denny and I be working together to preserve and protect the sport if I am no good as you try to portray me? :scratch:

Howie, I hate to have to pop your self-righteous, chest-beating, balloon facade that you are some sort of Savior for the sport. :rolleyes:

I know this sort of activity on my part frustrates you to no end. The vile personal attacks you spew are prima facie evidence of that pain.

Enjoy your little corner of the spearfishing universe and stop your whiney carping please. :knees: :D

What Blue Wild sponsor are you talking about Howie? :bs:

[waynewpb]

Headhunter I already scuba. Was certified by Jason ( Salty Dawg ). Excellent instructor and person by the way. Again I never bashed scuba spearing. I just said Freediving is more challenging. Like Mackdaddy said we're against the scooter bandits shooting up the fish on the shallow reefs where we Freedive, and bragging about how great they are.

[headhunter561]

Headhunter I already scuba. Was certified by Jason ( Salty Dawg ). Excellent instructor and person by the way. Again I never bashed scuba spearing. I just said Freediving is more challenging. Like Mackdaddy said we're against the scooter bandits shooting up the fish on the shallow reefs where we Freedive, and bragging about how great they are.

Fair enough. But for the most part, are there really that many scooter divers in less than 100'? Most eveyone I know who uses them, with the exception of lobstering, is using them in the 100++ foot stuff, where there is usually a 3-6 knot gulf stream current. Over exertion at depth is a serious danger, and the scooter makes managing those kind of currents at depth MUCH safer. If there are really a crowd of scooter bandits shooting up shallow reefs, thats a bit silly. But I think most are using them on the deeper stuff. Just trying to show the other side of things. Enough derailing...

[ROCKHIND]

Seriously Rockhind. Get off my shit. I didn't say one thing to you and you keep commenting on me. I'm sure Lou can fight his own battles, so get off his shit also.

I just used you as a segue to ask the weight of the warsaw, calm down.

[Marcus]

After spending an hour reading all of this, I can honestly say....my ass itches.

[chasintail]

After spending an hour reading all of this, I can honestly say....my ass itches.

Theres cream for that.

[hogsniper]

Settle down there cowboy, it's all in good fun right? I commend anyone for lobbying on behalf of the rec sector. Denny can't do it alone.

"I work and spend money on plenty of projects to preserve and protect this sport that you may not realize." Spearmax

:lol:I respectfully disagree with the first half of that statement and agree 100% with the second half. However, now is your chance to prove me wrong for once Tony, everyone from both boards is reading this thread. Now is the perfect opportunity to explain what you have been doing behind the scenes on secret projects to preserve and protect this sport. Why on earth would you pass up the opportunity to show everyone I'm wrong, unless of course I'm right on the money. So far I have $300 ring toss money for Denny(check must still be in the mail), rented a booth at the Blue Wild, and talked to Denny today(did he call to ask when to expect the ring toss monies?). Any other acts of valor or sacrifices for the sport? :cowboy: You belittle SFP for doing for others yet you can't even put together a simple list of charitable acts you have done in the past year? Now that we all see your lack of any kind of logical answer, it leads me to this:

I guess it's too bad nobody from Tallahassee called you to help us fundraise for Rob Murphy, because you sure told him and us to fukk off when you were approached because those auctions were being held on SFP. So instead of starting your own efforts, you did nothing. Or is that one of your secret projects that was just about to be announced? You insisted on moving them to a new site because you just couldn't stand to put up links to SFP. What a waste of a great opportunity to do something positive. I wonder how many of your "supporters" and sponsors know about that one. That is by far the lowest scumbag move you have ever pulled.

I recieved numerous spearfishing related calls today and just finished a 3 hour meeting with Denny, should I be listing all of that as contributions to the sport too?:sleep: I see you are getting upset at being pressed for direct answers so I will back off and allow you to compose yourself since you can't seem to provide answers as you instead fire insults back at me instead of answers. However you are great at making me have to cross reference half of your post with a dictionary, damn you for making me read twice because you are so smart:eek:.

And if you are gonna steal Spearfishing Planet's mission statement, it's "To protect, promote, and grow the sport of spearfishing", not preserve and protect, that came off a police cruiser's door somewhere. And to answer your question, I'm nobody, just the little guy living in your shadow... however my list of contributions and donations to interests other than my own is what I'm most proud of... too bad you feel that is something to be snubbed and far below you. :cowboy: I guess it all comes down to priorities and ROI.:thumps:

And you'll get your answers when you provide some of your own. :cowboy: Still think I'm running out of gas Tony? More importantly, what's the weight of the Warsaw?

[SpearMax]

Settle down there cowboy, it's all in good fun right? I commend anyone for lobbying on behalf of the rec sector. Denny can't do it alone.

"I work and spend money on plenty of projects to preserve and protect this sport that you may not realize." Spearmax

:lol:I respectfully disagree with the first half of that statement and agree 100% with the second half. However, now is your chance to prove me wrong for once Tony, everyone from both boards is reading this thread. Now is the perfect opportunity to explain what you have been doing behind the scenes on secret projects to preserve and protect this sport. Why on earth would you pass up the opportunity to show everyone I'm wrong, unless of course I'm right on the money. So far I have $300 ring toss money for Denny(check must still be in the mail), rented a booth at the Blue Wild, and talked to Denny today(did he call to ask when to expect the ring toss monies?). Any other acts of valor or sacrifices for the sport? :cowboy: You belittle SFP for doing for others yet you can't even put together a simple list of charitable acts you have done in the past year? Now that we all see your lack of any kind of logical answer, it leads me to this:

I guess it's too bad nobody from Tallahassee called you to help us fundraise for Rob Murphy, because you sure told him and us to fukk off when you were approached because those auctions were being held on SFP. So instead of starting your own efforts, you did nothing. Or is that one of your secret projects that was just about to be announced? You insisted on moving them to a new site because you just couldn't stand to put up links to SFP. What a waste of a great opportunity to do something positive. I wonder how many of your "supporters" and sponsors know about that one. That is by far the lowest scumbag move you have ever pulled.

I recieved numerous spearfishing related calls today and just finished a 3 hour meeting with Denny, should I be listing all of that as contributions to the sport too?:sleep: I see you are getting upset at being pressed for direct answers so I will back off and allow you to compose yourself since you can't seem to provide answers as you instead fire insults back at me instead of answers. However you are great at making me have to cross reference half of your post with a dictionary, damn you for making me read twice because you are so smart:eek:.

And if you are gonna steal Spearfishing Planet's mission statement, it's "To protect, promote, and grow the sport of spearfishing", not preserve and protect, that came off a police cruiser's door somewhere. And to answer your question, I'm nobody, just the little guy living in your shadow... however my list of contributions and donations to interests other than my own is what I'm most proud of... too bad you feel that is something to be snubbed and far below you. :cowboy: I guess it all comes down to priorities and ROI.:thumps:

And you'll get your answers when you provide some of your own. Still think I'm running out of gas Tony? More importantly, what's the weight of the Warsaw?

I had a feeling you would resort to the lowbrow tactic of using Rob Murphy's name to make one of your points.

Not surprising in the least. I guess we should all be happy you haven't resorted to your vulgar personal attacks here.

Get real Howie. I have helped Rob in so many ways you can't imagine including last week at the trial with the last minute purchase of dive flags for the prosecution. Where were you Howie? Just ask Rob about that, his scooter gift from me, the prosecution video, the legal meetings and on and on.

I guess I better start putting a list together for Your Majesty Sir Howard Scarboro, the King of the Spearfishing Universe :rolleyes:

I am not upset at all Howie - you hardly warrant the energy,

but I do have to set the record straight when you whine so much. :sleep:

By the way Howie, did you know that outside the trial courtroom Captain Newman told me he was going to drop Rob on some warsaws over here at his request to take him out because he was going to compete in the St. Pete Open? Imagine that Howie if Rob had shot a big warsaw and showed up at the SPO with it.

Ooops - sorry Rob - the rules were changed years ago. Yeah right.

Get a life Howie and vote in that poll so I can close it out. :D

I need to get back to working with Denny to help "Preserve and Protect" this sport.

We all want to see how good you are at fish size estimation from a photo.

Your fans and minions await. :allhail:

[sbh]

I enjoy shooting fish more than shooting pictures. At a certain point shooting pics of your fish takes a back seat to enjoying the adventure with your boys. This is about fun for me...not stoking my ego.

I invite you to come to NC and dive with us. We have a tournament every year in June...I will pay your entry fee, I will also help you with logistics (finding boat, lodging, etc). I think you will enjoy the format, it's freedive and scuba competing together...no separate categories. It typically attracts numerous national level divers, including world record holders, national champions, etc. Some of my best buddies from FL come up, friends from CA, and a bunch of good ole local boys. It's usually a 50/50 mix of divers but freedivers manage 80%+ of the awards. The local talent level may surprise you. If you are comfortable hunting at 80' you should do fairly well. Inshore is well within that depth. Pelagics are no problem...the tourney winning snapper and grouper will more than likely require 95'+ though, but a hail mary from 80' aka "death from above" may work on the shallower ledges.

I promise to be a good host and the boys are likable enough. Three days around that kind of group and it's hard not to learn something new. There are two pro photogs in the group and two of the best freedive videographers on the east coast. You will certainly have a disk full of hot new avatars and film clips when you return. If you only have a problem with Scuba divers that boast...then these guys are perfect for you. Those of us from that area don't spend much time posting photos or trip reports publicly (freedive or scuba). That may explain the lack of a "fishy" avatar on my part...then again, maybe I just can't shoot a fish. At the end of that weekend if you still need a more credible avatar from me you can take a pic of me holding one of your fish...I'll keep it up the rest of the year with a nod to you.

Rather than continuing to bicker and be negative, I'd rather to make this a positive thing. There is far too much polarity between scuba/freedive, east coast/west coast, GOM/Atlantic....on SB. To the point SB should really refer to "Sand Box". I'd rather not try to convince you that your viewpoint is flawed over the internet, rather I would like the opportunity to show you otherwise through diving and hanging out with divers of all types from all areas...many who freedive and blow bubbles. I feel confident that at the end of the weekend you will view it all differently. Nearly all of us meet up for this tourney not to compete but to get together and share three days of adventures...the results are secondary...this is infectious and I hope helps alter your perspective. If you still haven't changed your mind I PROMISE we can find a few like minded souls for you to vent with!

I am very sincere in this offer. I believe we cleared the air well enough, and I harbor no ill feelings. If this does not work out, I extend the same courtesy for the SPO next year...though I will not be of much help finding you a boat. Maybe you can trailer your vessel from SFL. An added bonus would be that you could confront Louis in person as well as a few others you may have referenced earlier. Either way, consider your entry fees taken care of and the first few beers on me assuming you are over 21. Should be plenty of cameras around...Hopefully I will be able to take care of that avatar issue for you.

Shoot me a pm if you are interested...may be a little early to get the ball rolling scheduling wise, but I won't forget...this offer has no expiration.

Great post Matt, if your ever down here you have a spot on my boat anytime.

[hogsniper]

I had a feeling you would resort to the lowbrow tactic of using Rob Murphy's name to make one of your points.

Not surprising in the least. I guess we should all be happy you haven't resorted to your vulgar personal attacks here.

Get real Howie. I have helped Rob in so many ways you can't imagine including last week at the trial with the last minute purchase of dive flags for the prosecution. Where were you Howie? Just ask Rob about that, his scooter gift from me, the prosecution video, the legal meetings and on and on.

I guess I better start putting a list together for Your Majesty Sir Howard Scarboro, the King of the Spearfishing Universe :rolleyes:

I am not upset at all Howie - you hardly warrant the energy,

but I do have to set the record straight when you whine so much. :sleep:

By the way Howie, did you know that outside the trial courtroom Captain Newman told me he was going to drop Rob on some warsaws over here at his request to take him out because he was going to compete in the St. Pete Open? Imagine that Howie if Rob had shot a big warsaw and showed up at the SPO with it.

Ooops - sorry Rob - the rules were changed years ago. Yeah right.

Get a life Howie and vote in that poll so I can close it out. :D

I need to get back to working with Denny to help "Preserve and Protect" this sport.

We all want to see how good you are at fish size estimation from a photo.

Your fans and minions await. :allhail:

Very inspirational, but why did you not want to participate when the auctions were running and you were directly asked? You have done for Rob in the past, but of all the opportunities to use SB for something great, you said no to this. Good to hear that you were involved with helping Rob afterwards though.

I was working the day of the trial, but a group was there from St. Pete including Grauer.

[pernicia]

I enjoy shooting fish more than shooting pictures. At a certain point shooting pics of your fish takes a back seat to enjoying the adventure with your boys. This is about fun for me...not stoking my ego.

I invite you to come to NC and dive with us. We have a tournament every year in June...I will pay your entry fee, I will also help you with logistics (finding boat, lodging, etc). I think you will enjoy the format, it's freedive and scuba competing together...no separate categories. It typically attracts numerous national level divers, including world record holders, national champions, etc. Some of my best buddies from FL come up, friends from CA, and a bunch of good ole local boys. It's usually a 50/50 mix of divers but freedivers manage 80%+ of the awards. The local talent level may surprise you. If you are comfortable hunting at 80' you should do fairly well. Inshore is well within that depth. Pelagics are no problem...the tourney winning snapper and grouper will more than likely require 95'+ though, but a hail mary from 80' aka "death from above" may work on the shallower ledges.

I promise to be a good host and the boys are likable enough. Three days around that kind of group and it's hard not to learn something new. There are two pro photogs in the group and two of the best freedive videographers on the east coast. You will certainly have a disk full of hot new avatars and film clips when you return. If you only have a problem with Scuba divers that boast...then these guys are perfect for you. Those of us from that area don't spend much time posting photos or trip reports publicly (freedive or scuba). That may explain the lack of a "fishy" avatar on my part...then again, maybe I just can't shoot a fish. At the end of that weekend if you still need a more credible avatar from me you can take a pic of me holding one of your fish...I'll keep it up the rest of the year with a nod to you.

Rather than continuing to bicker and be negative, I'd rather to make this a positive thing. There is far too much polarity between scuba/freedive, east coast/west coast, GOM/Atlantic....on SB. To the point SB should really refer to "Sand Box". I'd rather not try to convince you that your viewpoint is flawed over the internet, rather I would like the opportunity to show you otherwise through diving and hanging out with divers of all types from all areas...many who freedive and blow bubbles. I feel confident that at the end of the weekend you will view it all differently. Nearly all of us meet up for this tourney not to compete but to get together and share three days of adventures...the results are secondary...this is infectious and I hope helps alter your perspective. If you still haven't changed your mind I PROMISE we can find a few like minded souls for you to vent with!

I am very sincere in this offer. I believe we cleared the air well enough, and I harbor no ill feelings. If this does not work out, I extend the same courtesy for the SPO next year...though I will not be of much help finding you a boat. Maybe you can trailer your vessel from SFL. An added bonus would be that you could confront Louis in person as well as a few others you may have referenced earlier. Either way, consider your entry fees taken care of and the first few beers on me assuming you are over 21. Should be plenty of cameras around...Hopefully I will be able to take care of that avatar issue for you.

Shoot me a pm if you are interested...may be a little early to get the ball rolling scheduling wise, but I won't forget...this offer has no expiration.

Best post I've seen in a long time. :beer::beer::beer:.

[pernicia]

If that is your theory Rok I can respect that. I don't agree with it but everyone is entitled to their own opinions. Even though I don't agree with you I do apologize for the name calling. It doesn't solve anything. A more civil discussion would lead to a better thread. My beliefs are strong, and what you do makes me angry and that got the better of me.

I have been an avid Rod & Reel fisherman my entire life. Have caught many monsters and would love to show you more but main album was lost. Really sucks. Been stuck in the house with a new baby for three months, so hopefully some new monster pics soon.

You are correct. Shark was caught from the inlet and landed on the beach. Had to fight it against an outgoing tide using a 6/0 with only 40 lb test. Took three hours to land. I would say that's pretty skillful.
Do you have any Wahoo pics. Don't think many tank guys have gotten one. There's your next challenge if you haven't. Hopefully will get mine soon also.

Anyway best of luck to you also


Wayne, as you can see, keeping things in a more civil manner helps all of us wether is freediver or scuba. Take the offers and go have some fun, both geographical areas hold a lot of fish!:beer:

Best of luck and Dive Safe

[SpearMax]

Very inspirational, but why did you not want to participate when the auctions were running and you were directly asked? You have done for Rob in the past, but of all the opportunities to use SB for something great, you said no to this. Good to hear that you were involved with helping Rob afterwards though.

I was working the day of the trial, but a group was there from St. Pete including Grauer.

Cool - now back to the matter at hand Howie.

I will give you some clues to the weight of my fish.

Here are under water images:

First the hunt, then the kill:

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135183&stc=1&d=1282824680

http://www.spearboard.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=135184&stc=1&d=1282824680