Question for Riffe fans

[lseedle]

I am wondering why a Riffe gun is better than any other gun. Many people seem to think they are the greatest but cant tell me why. Even the guy at the dive store says "they just are". Can someone tell me what it is that makes it better than the other guns you have tried? Thank you!

[richhermes]

Because Julie Riffe is a hottie!!
http://www.speargun.com/images/julie/0016b.jpg


(I actually use a Spearfishing Specialties Commercial gun. I never have shot a Riffe yet.)

[bubblejunkie]

I'm not sure how hot she is, but Sherri ? last name? that I believe shoots a biller is very hot.

[fernandezh]

Seriously,
This is Riffe's claim to fame. They say that because their woods are made of laminates. Where they glue several layers of wood together to make a stronger wood barrel than if it were made of a single hunk of wood. I don't know, I have really never heard of a speargun barrel breaking before while using it.

I would say that when you are talking about open blue water spearfishing, such as for large pelagic tuna, that the riffe would be the better choice because some of their guns can accomidate something crazy like 4 high tension bands and they are better suited for using reels and floats. But for bottom shooting and freeshafting like what we mostly do in the Florida west coast, I can't see much of a significant difference between the Riffe competitor/standard series and other commercial brands.

All I know is that I have a JBL woody that shoots great but it is sometimes a pain in the ass to find a shop that has the replacement shafts that I am looking for in the Tampa Bay area.

My .02 cents. anybody want to add to this?

Hector

[SpearMaster]

My Personal opinion, Mainly because of the way the Riffe are made they with a single purpose in mind. Power an Silence. 1. is the Powerbands. 2. you can get smooth steel cable for your wraps, in which no matter how hard the prey trys to get away. The prey wont snap your line. The way the gun is design it's cant be heard when you fire the gun. Hence the fish wont get spooked and run away. And 4. is ask IyaDiver he can explain it great detail why the Riffe are the Greatest Speargun in the World.

Take it away Iya.


P.S. Fernadez, Riffe makes a thicker shaft 3/8 which is ideal for Tuna or any big game. " RIFFE Spear shafts are made of stainless steel, heat treated aerospace alloy." So they dont bend easily or get damage as much.

[Kasshia]

I have three. The Riffe Competitor #3XS is my favorite and primary daytime gun. #1 (11 yr. old son) has a Comp #2S that I sometimes borrow and my night gun is a Metal Tech #1, and that's probably not my last one. The quality of workmanship on these guns is superb. Riffe uses the same trigger design on all their models as they do on the Blue Water, their biggest, most powerful gun. This gun comes stock with 4x5/8"x32" bands for a combined force of 440 ft/lbs. and can be up-graded. The design of their mid-handles makes them a true mid-handle, meaning that while the trigger is located further up the stock the release mechanism is in the butt of the gun which allows for a longer shaft and longer band stretch which translates to more power in the same size package as a competitor's "mid-handle" that has the trigger and release mechanism located together further up the stock. While no speargun can be completely silent because of the snap of the bands on release, Riffe guns are very quiet. All their guns have a deep track which guides the shaft on release making for a very accurate gun and with the Metal Tech models you have the option of adding an enclosed track. Another option available for the Metal Techs is the aluminum muzzle which allows the use of four bands. Maintenance is very easy. I can, and have, taken all my guns completely apart using two sizes of Phillips head screwdriver and a small Allen wrench. Not that this is normally necessary. All I do after spearing is hose the guns off with freshwater, paying particular attention to the release mechanisms, then, after they dry, a quick shot of spray lubricant. Compared to other guns that are commercially available I consider the Riffes to be a semi-custom gun. They aren't the best that are out there, nor are they the most expensive, but I consider the price to be a good investment. Like a good deer rifle, these are guns that my grandkids and great grandkids can use as long as they're taken care of.

[bgbill]

I have 3 Riffe #3 Standard's, 1 Hawaiian, and 1 Competitor.

I will list a few of the reason's I think they are the best guns out there. I am sure I left out many.

The trigger, you can put as many bands on it as you want to and the trigger will still release without any extra effort. All Riffe's use the same trigger. Try doing 3 bands on a Biller a sea hornet or a S.S. gun, in my experience the trigger gets so stiff you can barely pull it.

The power of the Riffe is greater than the Biller and Sea Hornet types of guns. Greater power equals faster shaft speed, which equals shorter time of flight, less time for the fish to move once the trigger is pulled. Also better penetration of the shaft, and penetration with the shaft is always good.

The Laminated teak is very strong and stable wood, lamination's make it stronger and more stable. If you rinse them properly and oil the teak with teak oil once in a while they will look like new, also to sand down and refinish a Riffe only takes a couple of hours and the gun looks like brand new.

One of my 3# standard's was lost for 1 week in the Atlantic ocean, the gun had no problems and I still use it all the time, and it looks like new, the bands were still good for over a year.

They are very quiet and smooth guns.

The range when line shafting is greater than the Biller and Sea Hornet guns, also they have even more range when Free shafting.

I can load the Riffe quicker than I can my Biller gun, wether I am line shafting or free shafting. For me I think it is because of the shark fin tabs and the ability to have a rest tab on the shaft also. Sometimes when I don't need that much power on the gun I will put just 1 band on the rest tab and shoot from there.

The shafts are stronger because thay have sharkfin tabs for the power bands instead notches in them. I can also shoot 3 different diameter shafts out of the Riffe, 9/32", 5/16" and 3/8".

I like the Riffe bands better than any other brand out there, I currently use 1 3/4" x 26" band and 2 5/8" x 24" bands on the #3 and Hawaiian guns, I can shoot 1, 2 or 3 bands and when I first stared shooting the riffe I was using 4 5/8"x 24" bands. I have had bands last 3 years, they also do not get weak when they are loaded for an extended period of time.

The 5/8" x 24" bands have 120 ft lbs of energy
The 3/4" x 26" bands have 135 ft lbs of energy

I can free shaft or line shaft with the Riffe, I haven't done anything to the gun to free shaft other than use a shaft without a cable on it. When I line shaft I use 625 lb stainless cable, have never had it broken yet, it can be dangerous on a large fish so you must be careful.

The overall craftsmanship and detail on the guns is very good.

I have been using the Riffe's for a long time, and if there was a better gun I would use it.

I use my guns as bottom guns, around wrecks, free shafting line shafting, free diving, scuba what ever, I think they are great all around guns and they are also the best for blue water.

The only drawback on the Riffe is I haven't figured out a way to carry an extra shaft, I have a couple of idea's I just haven't tried them out yet.

The Biller Sea Hornet and S.S. Guns are all good also, I just prefer the Riffe and think they are the best for me.

[Spearchucker]

"Mainly because of the way the Riffe are made they with a single purpose in mind. Power an Silence"

Isnt that two purposes??

[Kasshia]

Thanks, bgbill, you covered some things I left out. Also, there is a fourth option in shaft diameter. If anyone wanted to go smaller there is the 1/4" shaft: http://www.bluewaterhunter.com/index.html :)

[dlock]

I used to own a Riffe CX2 and it is a top quality gun. One thing that has not been mentioned yet is how streamlined and light they are...oh wait that was two things:D it is a superior gun, BUT Seahornets customized by a certain local steelslinger KICKS RIFFE'S ASS!! It may weigh a little more and may not swing around in the water as easily but it is even more accurate than the Riffe. Which by the way is extremely accurate. The commercial setup on a Seahornet gun CANNOT be beat...just my .05 worth!

[bgbill]

Originally posted by dlock
I used to own a Riffe CX2 and it is a top quality gun. One thing that has not been mentioned yet is how streamlined and light they are...oh wait that was two things:D it is a superior gun, BUT Seahornets customized by a certain local steelslinger KICKS RIFFE'S ASS!! It may weigh a little more and may not swing around in the water as easily but it is even more accurate than the Riffe. Which by the way is extremely accurate. The commercial setup on a Seahornet gun CANNOT be beat...just my .05 worth!

I have heard people say the S.S. Guns are more accurate.

Have they been tested for accuracy against each other?

[Dogmatrix]

Well on the whole riffe sea hornet subject... the sea hornet can stay sitting in the cuboard... if anyone heads this way from the states ect and wants to borrow a wood gun... your welcome to come out with me and use it. Personally I will never grab a SH again unless the cubbord is bare.

The riffe MT#5s with Kitto slim slip tip... now thats some serious $$ right there... I have shot it a few times but the annoyance and aggrevation of loading up all the rubbers to give a 5/16th shaft a bit of go gettum while the pelagics circle waiting patiently is just not an enjoyable thing.



The RA 1.4 M saracen Railgun... well now... there is a gun I can appreciate. Double 16mm bands, 7mm shaft, breakaway setup, these guns are light easy to manouver and track... I have just recieved the 1.4 but have been using a 1.3 railgun for some time. Use whatever you like...

Don't buy a gun because it makes you look like a pro... buy a gun that you personally are going to be happy with. i havent seen a fish I wouldn't feel comfortable landing with an RA... they are IMHO more accurate then the riffes ect, and this is why the other guns stay at home when I go out spearing. I have also gotten some nice fish ranging from ulua to macks and small tuna, to lovely eating fish like coral trout and barramundi cod. Hope i have not offended to many riffe users. Each to thier own!

Rob

[IyaDiver]

I agree with bgbill, Kasshia and Spear Master.

I think a Riffe is not expensive for what you get, in terms of quality, build and longevity. Wood lamination is a good thing. They orient the grain in criss cross fashion resulting in a more stable and all around stronger wood. Teak is also one of the best choice for underwater use. However all these are expensive to do and use.

Many people think Riffe is for blue water only, it is not true. The Competitor series is small and very agile, just like a Euro gun. The mid-handle Hawaiian is a fun great all around Riffe teak gun.

One of the beauty of the Riffe is the potential to power it up to levels only found in custom guns like Alexander and Kitto. You need not worry trigger or muzzle or barrel breaking with a Riffe.
A trigger is the heart of any speargun and Riffe mech is one of the best in the market. Do remember that Jay Riffe built his gun for big YF tuna of Mexico, it was a labor of love. When he sets world records, people wanted to buy his gun, hence he started selling them commercially. So when other manufacturers are making small guns and later bigger guns to capture the market, Jay Riffe did the opposite. All his components are tested by himself in real hunt. I feel very safe with a Riffe trigger holding my many bands. Many other manufaturers who are making bigger and bigger guns from their smaller guns are having problems with the trigger mech. Try loading lots of rubbers to some spearguns, you might end up getting a self firing gun.

The Metal Tech series is a reasonable priced models with greatest powering up potential. If you are into engineering and mettalurgy, you will be happy to see how the Riffe Metal Techs are being built by dismantling them completely. The attention to details, corrossion protection, silencing mechanism and the barrel quality is just great.

When you start shooting weary fishes which are big say 40# upwards and won't come closer than 15 feet from your speartip, you will be glad to have a rigged Riffe in your hand.
Mid-handle Riffes or any other brands of mid handle for that matter is sweet to hold and swing. Same weight and volume, a mid handle is so much nicer than a rear handle in the hands.

None of my 5 Riffes ( MT0, MT3, MT5 Standard #2 and Standard #4 ) is plain, all have been rigged to the maximum. In off the shelf form, a Riffe is nice but when you rigged up for extra power, that is when it shines.

I use my MT0 for wrecks with 2.5 knots current or more.

Standard #2 for wrecks when current under 1.5 knots and freediving for small Rainbow Runners. This is my reef gun too. Also my kill gun standing by on the boat for ethicaly killing a big fish.

Standard #4 was my long range gun and now replaced by the MT3.

My fully rigged MT5 is a back up for real clear water and super shy fishes. Since I am short and the gun is big with the full wing kit, I prefer my MT3.

The best buy for me is my MT3. Powered by 6 bands of 9/16". 3/8 shaft, 4 double wraps of shooting line (almost 28 feet long ) and the Ice Pick Slip Tip. With the two wing kits it is a single hand hold gun at 6 bands....amazing. It tracks sweet like the Riffe Hawaian mid-handle but can take 2 more of the 9/16" bands.

My core hunting group all have at least 3 Riffes if not 4 or 5 guns each person.

If your targetted fishes are not very shy and will be only 6-10 feet away from your speartip, you won't benefit much from a Riffe other than it is accurate and powerful.

I do hate having to load so many bands but this is what makes me more careful in choosing what I realy want to shoot. I enjoy shooting from a good distance, also it is because my fishes here are divers shy.

My typical hunt is hovering mid water at depth ranging from 70-150 feet with bottom of 130-230 feet and facing the blue water while keeping the submerged pinnacle/sea mount behind me.
I wait for pelagics to come, sometime ranging a distance is difficult because the water is usually dark and not a great viz.
I need a gun with a good range and power for my hunt.

I have owned 5 pneumatics in the past, now I keep one new Mares Cyrano 850 for memory sake. I have owned and used all models of JBL including the Woody Magnum and XHD series. I was given two Euro single band guns and a 48" AB Biller by a friend. The latest gift I got was a Collins custom gun ( Aussie made ).

Today I still prefer the Riffe over any other brands due to the nature of my shooting. However I have a few other brands in mind to buy in the future for collection and learning.

In the end it is about what kind of fishes you shoot, its size and how many you want to bring home and how close you can get to them, this will dictate the proper gun for the hunter.

[bgbill]

Originally posted by Dogmatrix



Don't buy a gun because it makes you look like a pro... buy a gun that you personally are going to be happy with. i havent seen a fish I wouldn't feel comfortable landing with an RA... they are IMHO more accurate then the riffes ect, and this is why the other guns stay at home when I go out spearing. I have also gotten some nice fish ranging from ulua to macks and small tuna, to lovely eating fish like coral trout and barramundi cod. Hope i have not offended to many riffe users. Each to thier own!

Rob

I have never looked at the RA guns, I like te Riffe's but don't worry about offending me, everybody has their ideas of what is best, all I can do is say what I think is the best for me based on my experiences.

[Wet Spot]

I've shot quite a few records and top ten fish with a JBL but had to put it down when I got comfortable with my Riffe. It's smoother and longer shooting. All of the cable involved is a pain in the ass but at least I get fish that the JBL wouldn't.

Stan Smith

[yonfuki]

uh...I agree with "Julie is a hottie" theory (so is Sherri Daye but she doesn't have a speargun company named after her).

[rigdvr]

Originally posted by bubblejunkie
I'm not sure how hot she is, but Sherri ? last name? that I believe shoots a biller is very hot.

Sherri Daye actually shoots Daryl Wong custom guns. They make Riffe and everything else look like a toy. As far as production guns go, Riffe is the tops, but there is a whole world of custom guns out there built by legends one at a time such as Steve Alexander, Bill Kitto, Daryl Wong, Scott Merlo, and Darian Yokooji to name a few.

I guess there is a gun for every situation as I think the SS commercial is perfect for what most of you all are doing. I certainly dont use my Wong Bluewater gun when hunting shallow reefs. When scuba hunting the rigs I actually use a lowly JBL Gulf Magnum, its quicker for that type of stuff. But when I freedive I love shooting one of my Daryl Wong guns. So I guess comparing guns needs to be in the context of a specific purpose not just in a my gun rules yours sucks way.

BTW check out Daryls custom guns at wongspearguns.com (http://www.wongspearguns.com)

[RabiSpear]

There are several reasons why a Riffe is a good gun. Believe it or not, they make the most economical blue water guns. If you don't believe this, check out Daryl Wong or Klecko spearguns sometime. The reason they shoot farther is that they can accomidate various spear sizes. I heavier spear allows you to put on more power with less chance of shaft whip. (A weakness for Riffe is the lack of ballasting, which results in recoil effects on accuracy) Also, a heavier spear packs significantly more punch at a greater range. I believe most gulf bottom guns use a 9/32 spear, but a Riffe comes standard with a 5/16. Heavier spears with more power make all the difference if properly employed.

[yonfuki]

Daryl Wong is probably not a hottie...Julie is. But I don't think my spear is very heavy or packs enough power.

[rigdvr]

Riffe seems more economical at first but by the time you add the necessities of a good BW gun it usually costs more. Priced a Riffe bluewater with wings lately? Or looked at ugrading the muzzle and adding floaters to a MT?

[JCACTION]

The environment dictates the gun. There is no single perfect gun for every situation. In my opinion, you have over 80 years of experience between Daryl Wong, Mori, Heinrich and Terry maas who is probably the best blue water hunter in the world. Blue water hunting and long range shots are better handled by guns made by the above mentioned guys. However, if you are bottom fishing and can get close to your prey, ANY and I mean ANY gun will almost do. I have read lots of negative comments about pneumatics here. Anyone doubting the guns should take a look at Pepin Ferrara using the Mares cyrano. Sometimes its not the gun but more the hunter and how he uses his tools

[rigdvr]

Yeah, Pipin...thats it:confused: Anyone capable of the depth could shoot those big groupers he killed in his videos. Wish I could sneak a gun into the Bahamas like him...

[monster slayer]

The environment dictates the gun. There is no single perfect gun for every situation. In my opinion, you have over 80 years of experience between Daryl Wong, Mori, Heinrich and Terry maas who is probably the best blue water hunter in the world. Blue water hunting and long range shots are better handled by guns made by the above mentioned guys. However, if you are bottom fishing and can get close to your prey, ANY and I mean ANY gun will almost do. I have read lots of negative comments about pneumatics here. Anyone doubting the guns should take a look at Pepin Ferrara using the Mares cyrano. Sometimes its not the gun but more the hunter and how he uses his tools

I disagree, The Wong's ono gun is the most versatile gun ever, you can use it for closer distance situations with just three bands, and it will do the trick, is the better s.g. ever, pound by pound in the world today, sooner or later you too will want to have one as you primary gun..

[Steve Bennett]

I disagree, The Wong's ono gun is the most versatile gun ever, you can use it for closer distance situations with just three bands, and it will do the trick, is the better s.g. ever, pound by pound in the world today, sooner or later you too will want to have one as you primary gun..

I don't see how you could possibly disagree with JCACTION. I love my Wongs, but even if the Wong Ono gun is the most versatile gun around, it isn't the best for every situation. I would take a 75 cm euro with a 1/4" shaft any day of the week against an ono, if I was shooting in 4 ft. of viz at those European pinfish. I would take a 47" hybrid over an Ono any day of the week if I was shooting reef fish in 10' of viz. The bottom line is that a 63" bluewater gun is not always usable, regardless of its versatility. That is why even Daryl sells 55 different gun models and configurations. All of the best divers have multiple guns to fit different situations, end of story.

[NOTANX]

I am wondering why a Riffe gun is better than any other gun. Many people seem to think they are the greatest but cant tell me why. Even the guy at the dive store says "they just are". Can someone tell me what it is that makes it better than the other guns you have tried? Thank you!

mabe you should shop at a different dive shop! there are many great guns to buy and use. your decision should be based on your indiviual abilities and the areas to be hunted in. it sounds like he just wants to make a quick sale!

[Chad Carney]

Nearly 3 years later... opinions on guns are still as diverse!

Chad

[Bill McIntyre]

I am wondering why a Riffe gun is better than any other gun. Many people seem to think they are the greatest but cant tell me why. Even the guy at the dive store says "they just are". Can someone tell me what it is that makes it better than the other guns you have tried? Thank you!

The guy at the dive shop tells you that they are the best because they are among the best he can sell you.

He can't sell you Wong guns because they are sold direct. A local dive shop near my house sells Riffe, and he tells everyone who will listen that Wong guns are worthless junk. I guess that's business.

[bgbill]

One of my favorite guns is a Teak Track gun made by Big Pig (Ken Jones) and his drinking buddies.

[Fondueset]

I have an mt0 which I got large to experiment with. It's way short for my visibility - which is normally around 50 feet and up over a hundred at times during the winter - when the fish all vanish :) I've taken the opposite tack from Iya with mine - I have a 1/4 inch shaft and it shoots very nicely with two wraps using a 5/8 and a 9/16 band. Distance from muzzle is about 12 feet with two wraps and the shaft arrives there with quite a bit of enthusiasm. Penetration at 11.5 feet is quite sufficient for the soft, quick fish around here. Next I'm trying a 3/4 inch band.

No doubt the riffe is a very sturdily built piece of kit. The mid-handles are not as intuitive to aim as 'euro' styled guns. I also like the way my Omer Cobra handles recoil - because of the higher grip. But it's a very solid, well engineered little workhorse and shoots very nicely and quite far. I'll bet with a 3/4 and a 9/16 she'll go 14 feet with this light shaft.

[NOTANX]

The guy at the dive shop tells you that they are the best because they are among the best he can sell you.

He can't sell you Wong guns because they are sold direct. A local dive shop near my house sells Riffe, and he tells everyone who will listen that Wong guns are worthless junk. I guess that's business.


exactly

[5am]

power, silence, and fanboys lol, thats what the huge price tag gets you.
lets face it, they're all hype

sure riffe uses laminates, but so does plywood

when you buy a riffe your buying the name

If I were you, I'd go out with some friends and try different spearguns, get whichever one feels right.

[Amerikan 33]

Well to pretty much agree with the rest of the majority...yeah you pay big bucks to have that power and silence...I have own a JBL...and moved on to the New Riffe Euro, they are incredibly accurate and quiet....they do cost a pretty penny though...especially for us college kids :thumps: :eek:

J. Pimentel

[monster slayer]

Riffes are great, their only downside is that for a few bucks more you can get a Wong piece of work :lol:

[bgbill]

sure riffe uses laminates, but so does plywood

when you buy a riffe your buying the name



Obviously you don't know the difference between plywood and the way a Riffe is built, or you wouldn't make such a stupid statement.

When you buy a Riffe, Wong, Kitto, Alexander or other high quality gun, you are not paying for a name, you are paying for quality.

[dive4bugz]

I have several Riffes... an Island, 2 Hawaaians, and a C1 (for my son whos gettng cert this summer). I love them for their quietness, accuracy, power, and they hold up up very well. The finish is great, Ive never had a problem with the safety/trigger mechanisms, or any other part for that matter. An all-around excellent shooting gun. Ive had Billers, and JBLs... neither holds a candle to the Riffes... IMO

[5am]

Obviously you don't know the difference between plywood and the way a Riffe is built, or you wouldn't make such a stupid statement.

When you buy a Riffe, Wong, Kitto, Alexander or other high quality gun, you are not paying for a name, you are paying for quality.

Obviously I didn't think an expert in the field of wood, and its varying degrees of quality might personally reply to my post. How stupid of me.

Lets review how a Riffe body is built:

1. A piece of teak is cut, then shaped in a CNC machine
2. Screw holes are then drilled
2. Next it is sanded and a lacquer finish is applied (laminate for you tech buffs) - and presto

explain to me how what I said earlier was so outrageous

And by quality what do you mean? All spearguns do the same thing in theory: kill fish.

[Lobsterman]

I'm not sure how hot she is, but Sherri ? last name? that I believe shoots a biller is very hot.

BJ,

Sheri Daye used to shoot and model for Biller. Now I believe she is almost exclusively a "WONG-ER"! As anyone with half a brain should be. Best guns on the market. Why? Because they are!!! :D

[tom harding]

5am,

you're getting your definitions of "laminate" and "laminated" a little mixed up. the riffes aren't made from a solid hunk of teak. they are made from 3 or 4 LAMINATED strips of teak, then everything else you listed. (i don't think they use lacquer, though)

[5am]

yeah yeah you're right

I heard its because its really difficult to get a strait piece of solid teak. But anyways after they're laminated, another finish is put on.

sorry about the mix up

[Bill McIntyre]

And by quality what do you mean? All spearguns do the same thing in theory: kill fish.

All cars do the same thing- get you from point A to point B, but there are a hell of a lot of differences between cars. Some do it more effectively, and some last a hell of a lot longer than others.

If you can't tell the differences in quality between Riffes and guns that cost half the price, then the Riffe would probably be wasted on you until you get more experience.

And while I used to have a Riffe Island and sold it, I didn't sell it because it wasn't high quality in terms of workmanship and durability. I just happen to think that the large guns are designed with too little mass for the shaft and bands they use, so have excessive recoil, which results in muzzle flip and low shots. But the trigger mechanism can handle all the rubber you care to load on the gun and never fail, which is more than you can say for many cheaper guns. The gun won't delaminate and fall apart, the line release will always work smoothly, and the gun will essentially last forever. They are very high quality guns, but don't get one until you can see that for yourself.

[bgbill]

Obviously I didn't think an expert in the field of wood, and its varying degrees of quality might personally reply to my post. How stupid of me.

Lets review how a Riffe body is built:

1. A piece of teak is cut, then shaped in a CNC machine
2. Screw holes are then drilled
2. Next it is sanded and a lacquer finish is applied (laminate for you tech buffs) - and presto

explain to me how what I said earlier was so outrageous

And by quality what do you mean? All spearguns do the same thing in theory: kill fish.

figure out what his costs are for the wood, the other components, R&D, overhead profit, etc. and you will realize his guns are not that bad of a price, they are also complete guns, you don't need to buy anything else.

Jay is a manufacturer who sells his guns to the retailer, so if a hawaiian sells for $600, he is not getting the full $600, he is probably getting more like $350 and the dive shop is getting the rest.

Also on his guns as well as other sporting goods, there is a 10% excise tax, that is paid by him and that gets passed along to the consumer.

His guns do not have a laquer finish on them, it is a tongue oil finish.

I have a gun made by a friend of mine, that is a track gun, that I actually think is better than the Riffe's and the Wong's and all the other guns out there, but it is a custom gun and they only make a few a year.

If you don't like them and you think they are too expensive that is fine don't buy them, when I first saw them I thought they were overpriced also, but now I own 7 of them.

I also shoot a Biller gun that was my 1st gun, it was a 48" gun, but I bought a stock from Ray Odor and made it longer than a 60" gun, and use it quite a bit, and it is s great gun as well.

Team Headhunter and other guys like Ritchie Zacker use Kevins Spearfishing Specialties guns, and they sure kill a lot of huge fish.

It's not really just the gun, to quote Moose "it's not the gun, it's the man putting you on the spots and the man pulling the trigger" that may not be an exact quote, but it pretty much sums it up.

[5am]

Bill M., I agree with what you said, Riffe has a great trigger no doubt, its not being disputed. But thanks for the Riffe plug, jk.

bgbill, I'm not too sure that Riffes price is that low, the new JBL Elite is 200 dollars less with all the bells and whistles. Its got an open muzzle, string bands, fin tabs on the shaft, mono shockline (no slide ring), and high-end zebra wood.

[monster slayer]

I don't see how you could possibly disagree with JCACTION. I love my Wongs, but even if the Wong Ono gun is the most versatile gun around, it isn't the best for every situation. I would take a 75 cm euro with a 1/4" shaft any day of the week against an ono, if I was shooting in 4 ft. of viz at those European pinfish. I would take a 47" hybrid over an Ono any day of the week if I was shooting reef fish in 10' of viz. The bottom line is that a 63" bluewater gun is not always usable, regardless of its versatility. That is why even Daryl sells 55 different gun models and configurations. All of the best divers have multiple guns to fit different situations, end of story.

i had a 63'jbl Magnum for a pretty while until i grabbed an Ono gun. I can hit a dime with it at 20 ft!!

[Nate Baker]

Hey! Look! Another speargun thread! Same old claims and counter claims. This whole discussion, while entertaining, is all but useless from a consumer education standpoint as evidenced by the fact that it keeps coming back. It's just fun to talk about technical stuff.

I gather our original poster is either looking for a gun. If so, I suggest finding the best divers in your area who are pursuing the same fish you intend to pursue, and ask them what they're shooting and why. And ask if you can see/hold the gun while they're answering your questions. Whichever gun you buy, you're going to be trading off certain qualities in favor of others, even if you buy a Riffe.