Renewable Energy

[Fis_Hunter]

It is all good but there are some problems there is no way of storing energy produced for future use. The amount of solar energy produced while the sun is shining will not be available when it is dark. If we rely on solar energy we need another source of energy at night or when there are clouds. If we have a coal or gas power plant it can take days for it to ramp up to full production so we would have to keep it running full tilt during the day so we would have the power at night.

The same holds true for wind power.

Seems to me that the only way we can produce the power we need is through nuclear power. It is clean can run all the time and is cheep. Last I heard Obama was against Nuclear power.

If we are using power sources which fail to produce at times we need backups so we have constant power sources we can rely on.

[barnaclebill]

There are at least a couple ways of storing the power, the most obvious is batteries.

I just read an article where they were storing compressed air that was made with excess electricity from wind mills that would power turbines when the wind is not strong enough.

Also, today anyone can mount solar panels on their home and with an inverter like I have sell the excess power back to the power company.

It is a law that they have to do it.

[jackpine savage]

It is all good but there are some problems there is no way of storing energy produced for future use. The amount of solar energy produced while the sun is shining will not be available when it is dark. If we rely on solar energy we need another source of energy at night or when there are clouds. If we have a coal or gas power plant it can take days for it to ramp up to full production so we would have to keep it running full tilt during the day so we would have the power at night.

The same holds true for wind power.

Seems to me that the only way we can produce the power we need is through nuclear power. It is clean can run all the time and is cheep. Last I heard Obama was against Nuclear power.

If we are using power sources which fail to produce at times we need backups so we have constant power sources we can rely on.

You would only place wind turbines which have a history of consistent wind. It doesnt take that much wind to produce energy so even if its only blowing 5 kts the turbines are still producing a good amount of energy. Solar at this point is best used on individual buildings such as residential and small commercial buildings. With the use of an inverter you can store the extra energy in a bank of batteries for later use. Of course if there was a larger commercial push on both these energy sources then the amount of capital available for r&d in these technologies would increase.
I am with you on the nuclear source, technology has come a long way in the last 20 years.
Anything but a continuation of sending our dollars to people who hate us.

[mepps1]

Anything but a continuation of sending our dollars to people who hate us.

Hold on a minute. The vast majority of your fossil electric dollars stay right here in the good ol' USA. Most of them come here to the Powder River Basin, in fact. And we don't hate you a bit.

[Christof]

Mepps, arent you confusing money going to American companies with money being spent in the USA?
I think we get most of our oil from Canada, and although close, that is not America...

[jackpine savage]

Hold on a minute. The vast majority of your fossil electric dollars stay right here in the good ol' USA. Most of them come here to the Powder River Basin, in fact. And we don't hate you a bit.

I was refering to natural gas and oil, not coal.

[Fis_Hunter]

The problem I see with our current battreys is the toxic waist from the acid and lead.

We have several large wind farms in california on any given day the majority of them are not moving. Some are but there are still days when they are not moving. If we depend too much on a power source which has the potential of stopping even if it is only for a few hours we need a back up system or we will have black outs or brown outs.

[mepps1]

I'm all for wind power, to a degree.Wyoming has lots of that to sell, too. But I certainly don't care to see giant turbines on every hill. And it's not even remotely the solution that many think it is. Just a part. Probably a small part.

[barnaclebill]

If every roof in Florida was covered with solar panels, they would not need any new power plants here.

One of the big problems is people are getting too soft and can't live without AC. 3/4 of all the houses in this town are empty ten months a year and the air is on in all of them all the time. Half the boats I clean are sitting at docks with the air running and they haven't been out in a month.

People are just going to have to change their wasteful habits.

[Christof]

3/4 of all the houses in this town are empty ten months a year and the air is on in all of them all the time. Isnt that for moisture build up and to prevent mold and mildew?

[Otis Driftwood]

Isnt that for moisture build up and to prevent mold and mildew?

Keeps the art safe.

[barnaclebill]

Isnt that for moisture build up and to prevent mold and mildew?

That is what they say but personally I think that is a pretty lame excuse.

First off, If someone chooses to live in a humid place they should be able to tolerate a little humidity, if you want it dry move to AZ.

Secondly, houses can be designed to keep the air flowing that will take care of moisture buildup and mildew.

Boats can be fitted with solar powered vents that will do the same.

People just take the easy way and don't really care.

[zenspearo]

They got this figured out over a century ago. Look up "pumped storage" hydroelectric power plant.

"At times of low electrical demand, excess generation capacity is used to pump water into the higher reservoir. When there is higher demand, water is released back into the lower reservoir through a turbine, generating electricity."--wikipedia.

Bay Area residents driving to LA often pass by San Luis Reservoir on HWY 152. It's a huge body of water used as a pumped storage hydroelectric plant.

"San Luis Reservoir and O'Neill Forebay serve as the upper and lower reservoirs for the William R. Gianelli pumped storage hydroelectric plant, which began operating in 1968. The plant's eight Francis turbines produce a combined 424 MW."

[Christof]

I have spent the last couple years working at Hospitals away from home, and the last 1 1/2 yrs spent 4 days a week away from home.. I never left the AC on, but did leave a couple ceiling fans on low and windows open for air circulation.. Worked very well, but still used electricity...
A buddy of mine, some would call him a "Cracker" has made this statement several times.. "If they wouldnt have invented AC, florida would still belong to the Indians"....
I have a feeling that is true..

[Christof]

They got this figured out over a century ago. Look up "pumped storage" hydroelectric power plant.

"At times of low electrical demand, excess generation capacity is used to pump water into the higher reservoir. When there is higher demand, water is released back into the lower reservoir through a turbine, generating electricity."--wikipedia.

Bay Area residents driving to LA often pass by San Luis Reservoir on HWY 152. It's a huge body of water used as a pumped storage hydroelectric plant.

"San Luis Reservoir and O'Neill Forebay serve as the upper and lower reservoirs for the William R. Gianelli pumped storage hydroelectric plant, which began operating in 1968. The plant's eight Francis turbines produce a combined 424 MW."
Good example of this is where I am from, Washington State... Grand Coulee is the best example.. Banks lake has water pumped to it from the Columbia, up quite an elevation and I think about a 1/4 mile, thru huge pipes... It is used mostly for irrigation, but also for electricity generation.. Pretty amazing, considering it was built many many years ago..

[barnaclebill]

I have spent the last couple years working at Hospitals away from home, and the last 1 1/2 yrs spent 4 days a week away from home.. I never left the AC on, but did leave a couple ceiling fans on low and windows open for air circulation.. Worked very well, but still used electricity...
A buddy of mine, some would call him a "Cracker" has made this statement several times.. "If they wouldnt have invented AC, florida would still belong to the Indians"....
I have a feeling that is true..

I know it is true.

BTW running fans is very efficient compared to AC, You can do that with small solar panels.

[barnaclebill]

A friend of mine built a very efficient house here on 28th street, he finished it a couple years ago, he built it mostly by himself.

It is 2 story circular concrete with a nice tower on top. He designed it himself. Air comes in from all the doors on the circle walk around the second floor, which is the living quarters, and up his high ceiling to a huge vent in the center, which can be helped by a big fan in there.

It works real well and he hardly ever turns on the AC.

My old dive buddy Jerry lives across the canal from the round house and he has an old conch house that he has lived in 40 years and never uses AC, it has jalousie windows on all sides and ceiling fans in every room and the place always feels comfortable to me.

[Fis_Hunter]

There are a couple of problems with solar one is the cost vs the amount of power you get in return. The last I heard the cost of the solar pannel exceeded the amount of power it would generate in its usable lifetime. Solar only works when the sun is shining which is the time of day when the least power is needed. Most lights and appliances are not in use during the day. Again you have a bunch of batterys which you have to maintain and replace.

[cmfish]

How about energy being used from waves. There is a couple of these already started in europe. Also a large project being researched right now by FAU to use the current in the gulf stream to power large turbines. Another option is OTEC, ocean thermal energy conversion. There is more options out there than just solar, wind, and nuclear.

[barnaclebill]

The cost is a big factor, I think I read where in a place like Florida it would take between 7 and 10 years to pay for the system, but after that you have free electricity,

Most solar panels have a 25 year warranty, I have some that I purchased 20 years ago and they are still working like new.

I think they are a bargain, the best investment I ever made.

One of them got knocked off the back of my sailboat because of a dumb move on my part, went in the salt water hanging by the wire. I fished it out and rinsed it off and remounted it. That was about 18 years ago and that panel is still working.

If you put them on your house you do not need a battery bank, you hook them to an inverter and it puts the power right to your fuse box, any power you do not use goes into the grid and your meter runs backward, you are selling it back to the power company.

[barnaclebill]

How about energy being used from waves. There is a couple of these already started in europe. Also a large project being researched right now by FAU to use the current in the gulf stream to power large turbines. Another option is OTEC, ocean thermal energy conversion. There is more options out there than just solar, wind, and nuclear.

They are building a water turbine system and testing it right now under the Bahia Honda Bridge.