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All About Guns What's your weapon of choice, and why? Discuss the beloved speargun here! |
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11-04-2016, 04:54 AM | #46 | |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
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11-04-2016, 07:39 AM | #47 | |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
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11-04-2016, 09:26 AM | #48 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
First post, fourth diagram shows how the cabling system works with the pulley on the piston nose. The preceding diagrams show the pulley, but not the actual version used in the gun as they are patent/concept drawings from when the design was first registered.
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11-04-2016, 09:36 AM | #49 | |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
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11-04-2016, 11:26 AM | #50 | |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
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As far as mixing up people - now I am REALLY mixed up- so i'm just going to make a blanket response for all involved- I apoogize if I annoyed you - or accusing you of being annoyed- without merit. I am not annoyed by these threads at all - I just have a hard time understanding these detailed diagrams- so it leads to questions - for the most part - they are so foreign to me that I can't even come up with intelligent questions about them. I was only suggesting that you guys move these threads into it's own category - IF we /me are annoying you with our simplistic questions. It appears I mistook your (tongue in cheek response) - as to you really being annoyed with me - which I thought was out of place because I asked a fair question in a respectful manner - and if you read through the thread - you will see others who were quite a bit ruder and dismissive than I was - but got no response- whereas I got a reaction. Either way - sorry to create drama on the thread. I will read more carefully next time - so as not to put my foot in my mouth again. Sorry about that guys - carry on. ok - here is a new (to me) question: why is this an airgun at all? It seems like just a wound up spring - that unwinds upon release.? Is it - just that - the unwinding springs - use a pocket of air to move the piston ? Still, it seems as if the new technology here is a coiled spring? Now seriously - I KNOW this has got to be a stupid question - and i'm sorry for it - but you asked for it - and you said you don't mind. And I REALLY want to know because - a wound up spring release - as the power for a shot - was /is an idea I pondered for a minute - a while back - but I assumed that it was too simple for me to have been the first to think of it oh - and one other thing - the bang question - pop guns - don't POP anymore? they are quieter than they used to be? that's cool - because that was a major drawback to me - at least on paper. One thing to note is - there is a guy who spears the keys commercially - his name is (nickname) is mojarra - and he uses a pop gun to shoot all his fish and he is one of the most lethal spearos there IS - around these parts. And his gun is LOUD! - so it must not matter THAT much anyway. But I gotta wonder if he isn't just SOO good that he could set off grenades underwater and still manage to be sneaky about it.
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Last edited by Impaler Spearguns; 11-04-2016 at 11:48 AM. |
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11-04-2016, 03:37 PM | #51 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
A compressed air column makes for a much better "spring" as the only friction is from the seals on the sliding piston that moves back and forth. Spring guns which used a long coil spring were popular in the early days (i.e. thirties, forties and fifties), but once pneumatic, or captive air guns stopped leaking air like sieves then the days of the metal coil spring speargun were numbered. This is because the efficiency of energy storage of coil springs is very low, you don't get out what you put in as the coils buckle and rub on the tube they are enclosed in. Also the spring itself absorbs energy which turns into heat and that is lost to propulsion. The spring gun had one big advantage, when you pulled the trigger you knew what you would be getting, unlike pneumatic guns which used to leak as no air pressure, no spring! Band guns back then used very poor rubber, so for a number of years the coil spring gun was top dog in the speargun pecking order. Improvements in rubber seals and band rubber soon toppled the spring gun from its perch.
Pneumatic guns are noisy, being "old skool" I used a Mares "Sten" pneumatic gun for decades and my dive buddy Richard said he could hear me taking a shot whenever he was out on the same reef! He told me that his thoughts at the time were "sounds like Pete has bagged another one". Being a pretty good shot as I had put hundreds of shots, if not thousands through it, that was generally the case. Things changed when about twenty years ago the vacuum barrel version of the pneumatic speargun arrived. As the gun no longer needed to push water out through muzzle relief ports those ports could be eliminated. Also metal pistons and shock absorber anvils had been replaced decades earlier with plastic versions which were not quite as noisy as the metal versions. Pneumatic spearguns also began to concentrate on efficiency, thus gun inner barrels were sized for the job, a 11 mm diameter inner barrel being used for slimmer spears such as 6.5 mm and 7 mm. If you wanted to shoot 8 mm shafts (close to 5/16”) then you had to stay with the 13 mm inner barrels which had been the industry standard. The forces being less when the piston collided with the shock absorber anvil in an 11 mm diameter inner barrel gun they tended to be less noisy, and the deletion of muzzle ports with a vacuum muzzle fitted further muffled the noise coming out of the gun. Last edited by popgun pete; 11-04-2016 at 04:22 PM. Reason: further comment |
11-04-2016, 04:32 PM | #52 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
Pneumatic spearguns are all about efficiency. They are the most efficient of underwater weapons loaded with the user’s muscle power. However efficiency is not everything, you need effectiveness as well, hence the multi-band rubber gun, which is not very efficient, is good for hurling larger diameter and/or longer length missiles at tough body structures and causing a lot of internal damage or which will gain a hold while the fish succumbs to its exertions or the arrival of further missiles sent by the hunter or his associates armed with similar weapons.
Depending on the hunting situation, and the nature of the prey, I use whatever gun is most likely to give me a result, so I have a bunch of band guns as well as pneumatic guns. If you use too many different guns then you never get your "eye in" with all of them, but familiarity with a few favorite guns then they are almost on "auto-shoot" as the gun will, in a sense, fire itself when a "firing solution" presents itself, in other words a deja vu shot. Basically the "Dreamair" gun is trying to be like an "Arbalete", but using "air spring" power rather than rubber band power. Using "air spring" or pneumatic power will improve the efficiency as there is no "band soak" as you have with rubber bands, but on the minus side there are a lot more items to move with that power (axles and drums to spin, long cables to wind and unwind, resistance to sliding of a large moving piston) and they will all remove energy that would otherwise be available for spear propulsion. The big question is do the pluses outweigh the minuses, or vice versa? My thoughts are that it will be ahead rather than behind on the criterion of operating efficiency with respect to its energy use, but that may be at the cost of increased unreliability. In order to minimize that happening a lot of effort is going into the cable drive transmission system as the components that we have seen so far must be some of the most expensive to manufacture items ever to go into a speargun. Hence the "Dreamair" speargun is trying to beat the odds by going the quad cam, 24 cylinder, twin V-block configuration route rather than using a simple pushrod V8. Last edited by popgun pete; 11-05-2016 at 03:44 AM. Reason: clarification |
11-08-2016, 03:16 PM | #53 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
I have been told by inventor Andreas that revisions are being made to what will be the production version of the "Dreamair" speargun as a result of the previous testing experience. An extra valve was suggested at the rear of the gun for the reasons shown on the attached diagrams, but there may be other tweaks to the design as well.
Update: Apparently the valve is already in the rear bulkhead, mounted below the shock absorbing column as can be seen in this new composite image photo. Last edited by popgun pete; 11-09-2016 at 04:09 PM. Reason: update and adding new photos |
11-18-2016, 02:48 PM | #54 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
Here is the loading device for "arming" the cable wishbone drive. Another variation of the loading device has a pulley attachment (which will be shown next) in order to create a mechanical advantage as you summon your strength to haul the wishbone(s) back to engage the shaft.
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11-19-2016, 07:13 PM | #55 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
The connection of the barrel (actually the tank) sliding piston to the inner drive cable is shown here.
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11-22-2016, 04:01 PM | #56 | |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
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11-27-2016, 03:18 PM | #57 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
A special multi-purpose tool has been created for routinely servicing the "Dreamair" speargun and is shown here. It should not take up too much room in the Lambo's toolbox.
Last edited by popgun pete; 11-27-2016 at 08:39 PM. |
12-10-2016, 09:08 PM | #58 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
Pumping up the "Dreamair" using the special hand pump supplied with the gun which screws into the small inlet port located under the muzzle.
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12-18-2016, 03:38 PM | #59 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
Good photos.
Do you know where I can find video of the gun shooting. And possibly when it will be for sale? |
12-18-2016, 05:46 PM | #60 |
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality
That is the "64 Million Dollar question", as they used to say, or at least I think it was 64. No one knows, but an indication was given by the inventor that a video of some sort would be available by Christmas. I expect that the "Dreamair" speargun needed some modifications after the testing revealed a few potential problems and that has thrown their schedules out. I check each day for any news, but nothing is showing up at the moment, although the Australian Patent for the design has been granted as of a couple of days ago.
Last edited by popgun pete; 12-18-2016 at 05:49 PM. Reason: adding patent front page |
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