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All About Guns What's your weapon of choice, and why? Discuss the beloved speargun here!

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Old 02-12-2017, 03:02 PM   #16
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Quick question. If you can get an RA aluminum from Neptonics for about $220 and someone said the RA Roller muzzle is about $200 (which is a little more than a MannySub muzzle), why not just buy the muzzle and build the gun for $400? I definitely know you can get MannySub muzzles in the U.S and it seems like you can get the RA ones from here as well.

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Originally Posted by spearq8 View Post
Any testing on how this gun shoots? Is great to hear that they spent some time analyzing how the gun shoots ... I think that is what is needed to fix the low shooting problem ... maybe they have done that?

As for Manisub ... when you say it shoot exactly where you point ... that would be a major improvement. Do you have video of shooting where you can see how the shaft behaves?
Hey Spearq8,

I made this video soon after I got the 100cm. My groupings have always been about 1-2cm high and 1-2cm to the left, regardless of what gun I shoot. My wrist tends to pivot left when I fire.

My video is nowhere near as comprehensive as yours but I just wanted to get a sense of where the shaft was going when I pulled the trigger. I don't use the 100 a lot as I only really hunt pelagics. My stock gun is a 120cm, single, 18mm band mannysub roller. I like it because of the lack of recoil, ease to load, and the fact that I can watch where the shaft goes as I pull the tripper (because the muzzle stays relatively still). Before that I shot an RA 120.




Here's a bunch of fish I shot last year with the 120, there are 2 x 15kg(35lb) yellowtail shot on the 100cm 16mm band gun from above in there as well.



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Old 02-12-2017, 03:20 PM   #17
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Well actually, I paid about $250 for a 110 RA from Neptonics. I believe the RA roller was $215, (didn't hear it too well due to initial sticker shock). Then you'd have to buy the band material and possibly whatever mounts are required to mount the bands to the gun. Also, at least from what I've been told, you need a loading tool of some kind to load the thing. (That may depend on how you set up the gun...).

For me, even if buying the parts and assembling the gun would be a bit cheaper, it would be worth a few $$ extra to know it's set up correctly.

My gun needs would have to change significantly though before the cost of a good roller setup would be justified.

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Old 02-12-2017, 04:30 PM   #18
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Why not buy the Pathos roller kit with the sepia and you have the three stages at the bottom for $135.

http://www.spearamerica.com/pathos-s...-kit-26mm.html
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Old 02-12-2017, 07:55 PM   #19
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

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Well actually, I paid about $250 for a 110 RA from Neptonics. I believe the RA roller was $215, (didn't hear it too well due to initial sticker shock). Then you'd have to buy the band material and possibly whatever mounts are required to mount the bands to the gun. Also, at least from what I've been told, you need a loading tool of some kind to load the thing. (That may depend on how you set up the gun...).

For me, even if buying the parts and assembling the gun would be a bit cheaper, it would be worth a few $$ extra to know it's set up correctly.

My gun needs would have to change significantly though before the cost of a good roller setup would be justified.

Ron.
RA from Neptonics $248 delivered.
Mannysub kit comes with everything, rubber cut to length, dynemma, bridle, muzzle. adapter for around $200. $450 total and assemble yourself with comprehensive instruction booklet. Or just buy a carbon fibre mannysub for $650 complete.

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Old 02-13-2017, 08:16 AM   #20
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Everyone, hurry up and buy one at Nautilus before Andrew's prices go up too! Haha I've never dealt with the guy but he's got some really cool video reviews which is how I learnt about the RA roller

https://www.nautilusspearfishing.com...argun-railgun/

I definitely agree it is overpriced here in Australia. I think most dive shops sell it for around $850AUD= $650USD, but then again, the RA Tuna model here sells for $450AUD= $345USD when they go on sale. Spear gear isn't cheap in the land down under.

When aussie spearos got into the roller craze, MVD was very popular initially. I would say the majority use mannysub roller heads now. For every 5 roller guns I see, 4 of them are either a mannysub complete gun or a RA with mannysub muzzle.

In order for the RA Tuna rollergun to be a competitive choice, I think having it in the ~$550-600AUD region would get them into the hands of spearos. Not to say that Rob Allen doesn't have a quality product, but $850 is a little steep with the other options available at the moment. I'll be heading into Adreno in the next few days and will definitely be checking out the gun in person
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Old 02-13-2017, 09:43 AM   #21
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Quote:
Originally Posted by aussie View Post
Quick question. If you can get an RA aluminum from Neptonics for about $220 and someone said the RA Roller muzzle is about $200 (which is a little more than a MannySub muzzle), why not just buy the muzzle and build the gun for $400? I definitely know you can get MannySub muzzles in the U.S and it seems like you can get the RA ones from here as well.



Hey Spearq8,

I made this video soon after I got the 100cm. My groupings have always been about 1-2cm high and 1-2cm to the left, regardless of what gun I shoot. My wrist tends to pivot left when I fire.

My video is nowhere near as comprehensive as yours but I just wanted to get a sense of where the shaft was going when I pulled the trigger. I don't use the 100 a lot as I only really hunt pelagics. My stock gun is a 120cm, single, 18mm band mannysub roller. I like it because of the lack of recoil, ease to load, and the fact that I can watch where the shaft goes as I pull the tripper (because the muzzle stays relatively still). Before that I shot an RA 120.

http://youtu.be/57ojURRMPRk



Here's a bunch of fish I shot last year with the 120, there are 2 x 15kg(35lb) yellowtail shot on the 100cm 16mm band gun from above in there as well.



http://youtu.be/_qB9Z68pGIo

That doesn't look like it is setup with a lot of power. Also 4m range is very short range and you really don't get an idea of what is happening with the shaft. In my roller testing, I can get the gun to shoot straight and not dive, but I need to really scale back the power. If I push the power, the shaft dives ... there is a max velocity where you have to accept to get the gun to shoot well. The thing is that this load is just way below what you can get with a normal classic 2 banded setup. Now if you understand that and accept that, then no problems ... the thing is many people are going with rollers as they think they are gaining performance.

If you are getting left shift, try the handle mod video I put it. It completely eliminates left shift ... I mean zero shifting no matter what load you put on or how light the gun is. Many people think that rollers don't have recoil, but of course they do and with a fixed handle there will be benefits.

Nice fish !!! Thanks for sharing that!
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Old 02-13-2017, 09:54 AM   #22
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

agreed with Maj, you don't really learn much from 8-12' tests on guns which should shoot twice that distance. Better to max out your distances in testing so that it becomes more obvious what is going on. Put your target at 20' from the tip of the shaft. You should still be hitting oranges and have some punch.
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Old 02-13-2017, 01:12 PM   #23
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

i was talking with my buddy greg that is the us RA distributor , he really lovers the new rollers , but like aussie said , manny is a awesome dude and ill stick wth my manny sub's
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Old 02-13-2017, 01:21 PM   #24
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Thanks, great feedback guys. I guess I target practice in zones I feel comfortable shooting in the real world. My 100 is my reef gun, I shoot it into holes and generally take shots in 8'-12' range . My 120 is my open water gun so I shoot fish more in 12'-16' range. I can't see myself ever taking a 20' shot. Besides I almost always run single wraps on all my guns.

Re. Power. I think people overestimate how much power these setups have. I believe (off feel, I have no quantifiable proof on this) that my 120 roller shoots about the same as a stock 125-130 euro with a smoother trigger pull and less recoil. And I load one band instead of two. That's about it.

SpearQ8 do you have a link for that vid?
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Old 02-13-2017, 01:37 PM   #25
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Quote:
Originally Posted by aussie View Post
Thanks, great feedback guys. I guess I target practice in zones I feel comfortable shooting in the real world. My 100 is my reef gun, I shoot it into holes and generally take shots in 8'-12' range . My 120 is my open water gun so I shoot fish more in 12'-16' range. I can't see myself ever taking a 20' shot. Besides I almost always run single wraps on all my guns.

Re. Power. I think people overestimate how much power these setups have. I believe (off feel, I have no quantifiable proof on this) that my 120 roller shoots about the same as a stock 125-130 euro with a smoother trigger pull and less recoil. And I load one band instead of two. That's about it.

SpearQ8 do you have a link for that vid?

If you mean the video where I am trying out a roller setup and trying to maximize performance for the roller and comparing it to the classic setup ... the video is here. I used a shorter gun as I thought it would have a better chance of outperforming a classic setup ... but even at 82cm the classic setup using 2 bands was much better. I did manage to get good results with the roller setup that were better than the default one 19mm band setup ... but once you put 2 x 14mm small ID bands on there ... performance of the classic setup was quite surprising even for me. I did manage to get good power out of the roller ... but shots were diving too low for me to be happy with that. Especially once you start taking shots at more than 4 meters. I just couldn't see myself using the roller as the performance was less and also loading was much more problematic with many more things to go wrong. It did have less recoil though ... but if you mod the handle the recoil advantage is gone.

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Old 02-13-2017, 01:53 PM   #26
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

I always try to get them to come in close. But what I'm saying is for the pool. You learn a lot from that extra 10' in the pool even if you'd never take that shot.
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Old 02-13-2017, 02:14 PM   #27
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Quote:
Originally Posted by aussie View Post
Thanks, great feedback guys. I guess I target practice in zones I feel comfortable shooting in the real world. My 100 is my reef gun, I shoot it into holes and generally take shots in 8'-12' range . My 120 is my open water gun so I shoot fish more in 12'-16' range. I can't see myself ever taking a 20' shot. Besides I almost always run single wraps on all my guns.

Re. Power. I think people overestimate how much power these setups have. I believe (off feel, I have no quantifiable proof on this) that my 120 roller shoots about the same as a stock 125-130 euro with a smoother trigger pull and less recoil. And I load one band instead of two. That's about it.

SpearQ8 do you have a link for that vid?
Energy storage comparison (rollergun can be thought of as "generic").
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Old 02-13-2017, 03:33 PM   #28
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Has anyone tried this Muzzle? Any thoughts?

http://www.mvd-retail.gr/index.php/e...stem-ds-detail
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Old 02-13-2017, 06:05 PM   #29
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

Sorry SpearQ8 I meant the one for the handle mod.

Pete I'm nowhere near smart enough to decipher that chart!
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Old 02-14-2017, 12:52 AM   #30
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Re: Rob Allen Tuna Rollergun

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Sorry SpearQ8 I meant the one for the handle mod.

Pete I'm nowhere near smart enough to decipher that chart!
Ah ok ... I put up 3 videos for the handle mod ... the first two are the important ones ... the third is just testing results. I think it is a good idea to go through the first video as it gives you an idea of what I am trying to achieve and the theory behind it. The second video is the actual build ... but really can probably be done differently. Carbon Fiber wrap is not necessary with the correct epoxy putty and I have done quite a few handles without CF. The CF has made the mod seem daunting to a lot of people, but CF gives you extra durability as it makes it much stronger without chance of chipping or coming off.



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