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Old 04-29-2020, 05:04 PM   #46
Cyprus_Spearo
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

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Originally Posted by kodama View Post
I ordered myself the 85 model directly with C4. Should have it in a few weeks and looking forward to testing it out.

I don’t think the points you mentioned will influence performance in any noticeable way with the short model. However it may be noticeable with longer versions but I am not in need for those anyway.
Did you use the gun while hunting or is it just an overall impression?

I have been looking for the shortest Monoscocca for years but they are very hard to find on the second hand market.
The guns I saw in Europe. I never used one. I will agree with you that on a single band gun with a 6.5mm shaft you will not have an issue.
The price is very high for such a mass production gun though. I would have hoped that this gun would retail for about $500-600 here in the US but it will be much higher.
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Old 04-29-2020, 08:12 PM   #47
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

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Thanks for sharing but I already have a great gun in that size. I am specifically looking for the shortest one they made which is 75 I believe.


I suspect not that many short ones were made and sold? I mean, in that size it’s often considered a hole gun. Which means it’ll get beaten up and also, ultimate power and precision is less important for close up shots. So, perhaps not many spearos wanted to stick a fancy and expensive C4 into a hole but instead bought the longer versions?


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Old 04-29-2020, 08:51 PM   #48
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

It would be good if C4 serial numbered their guns as then guns could be identified and there would be records of how many were made. Riffe serial number their guns and so do Mares, although the latter switched to stickers which are easily peeled off. Sometimes overseas distributors receive samples in a few sizes, so there is a possibility of sample short guns sitting in a warehouse that were never offered for sale. I have purchased a few NOS guns that were offered in a clean out when a dive shop/sports store shut down, migrating from a wall display to a dusty shelf in the back room before being sold off.
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Old 04-30-2020, 12:40 AM   #49
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

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Originally Posted by Cyprus_Spearo View Post
The guns I saw in Europe. I never used one. I will agree with you that on a single band gun with a 6.5mm shaft you will not have an issue.
The price is very high for such a mass production gun though. I would have hoped that this gun would retail for about $500-600 here in the US but it will be much higher.

Fyi I am paying €540 for the gun which is a lot of money but I am ok with it. Yes you can get something that does the same for €200 but I am sucker for carbon fiber spearguns.
I know there have been issues with people converting their 132 C4 Graphite into an inverter and flexing the barrel. However it sounds terrible if the Gladius just flexed under normal use. They said that the gun was treated extensively before during design so one would think they worked out the kinks.
There has been much debate about the design of the gun. And the design was heavily influenced by “what the market demanded”.
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Old 04-30-2020, 12:41 AM   #50
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

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I suspect not that many short ones were made and sold? I mean, in that size it’s often considered a hole gun. Which means it’ll get beaten up and also, ultimate power and precision is less important for close up shots. So, perhaps not many spearos wanted to stick a fancy and expensive C4 into a hole but instead bought the longer versions?


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I am not afraid to stick a carbon gun in a hole. A few scratches are not going to destroy it. I will certainly use this one for some hole hunting too.
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Old 04-30-2020, 12:50 AM   #51
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New C4 Gladius speargun

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Originally Posted by kodama View Post
I am not afraid to stick a carbon gun in a hole. A few scratches are not going to destroy it. I will certainly use this one for some hole hunting too.


Neither would I be and my CF-tubed airguns do have a few battle scars but they are also a whole lot cheaper. Was just trying to figure out why, after years of searching, you hadn’t been able to find a used short C4.

Well, writing the above prompted me to check myself and I don’t wanna rub salt in anything as you have already placed an order but in case you can get out of that, I just found an old used Monoscocca 75 for 190 euros... Also, a 61 Mr. Iron sold two months ago. It was listed at 250 euros. So, I guess they are around. Just, of course, not as often as the longer guns.


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Old 04-30-2020, 12:56 AM   #52
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

Quote:
Originally Posted by kodama View Post
Fyi I am paying €540 for the gun which is a lot of money but I am ok with it. Yes you can get something that does the same for €200 but I am sucker for carbon fiber spearguns.
I know there have been issues with people converting their 132 C4 Graphite into an inverter and flexing the barrel. However it sounds terrible if the Gladius just flexed under normal use. They said that the gun was treated extensively before during design so one would think they worked out the kinks.
There has been much debate about the design of the gun. And the design was heavily influenced by “what the market demanded”.

I would be really surprised if the C4 guns are flexing ... those things seem like stiff as hell! If it is flexing then that is a huge issue and is impossible to shoot accurately if there is a lot of flex. I noticed this problem with the new Salvimar Hero guns ... their longer guns just flex like crazy! But that is an aluminium gun ... CF has much more resistance to flex. If the C4 are flexing maybe adding one or two CF sleeves would solve the issue. On shorter guns flex is really never an issue unless the flex is coming from the trigger pocket or in the pipe to handle connection ... but that can be fixed with a little work. Remember ... flex is exaggerated if there is a lever action in play ... if the bands in the muzzle are adjusted to push directly linear to the gun then flex is minimized. That is why muzzle geometry is very important.
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:22 AM   #53
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

I doubt that the Gladius will be flexing with its modest band loads shooting skinny shafts. The band anchor muzzle slot shuts the door on stuffing too many bands into it. The very long Graphite guns have long thin forward barrels and using them as inverted rollers doubles the band load on the muzzle, even though the spear is only propelled by half of it. The toothpick-like front end was the reason that I bought the Urukay instead.
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Old 04-30-2020, 03:26 AM   #54
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New C4 Gladius speargun

Just for clarity sake I am not saying the Gladius will flex. My comment was in response to Cyprus Spearo who said this gun “could barely handle two bands”. I was suspecting he meant that the gun body isn’t able to withstand anything more powerful. Which by itself would be a bold claim having never used the gun. I might have misunderstood what he meant.
I expect the C4 guns to be plenty stiff for their intended use.

Anyway I will report on performance somewhere in June. I just hope i get enough time in the salt water with all the stuff going on.

Last edited by kodama; 04-30-2020 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 04-30-2020, 07:33 AM   #55
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

Some more pictures I found on the Italian forum.


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Old 04-30-2020, 08:31 AM   #56
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

The new guns have a full length track (what a surprise) and are slim around the girth compared to their other models, hence picking one up around the center section will be no trouble (unlike the Urukay which I cannot get my hand around at mid-body without risking me dropping it). Possibly this is the envelope customers want which does not depart too much from other guns, but has the C4 look and quality.

More exotic guns will no doubt be in the pipe while they can sell the Gladius as a general purpose gun.
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Old 05-01-2020, 01:32 AM   #57
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

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Originally Posted by kodama View Post
Some more pictures I found on the Italian forum.


No question … the Carbon body looks solid .. no flex there I think. Very very high handle … that is a huge plus. I would of course shape a handle as I hate their handle and feel it is not very tight and secure and can twist on heavy loads. The trigger … oh man do I hate that non symmetrical look on top … but I could live with that I guess … I have no idea why they just didn't put that line release screw center and maybe even have it recessed into the mech box. Seems like the track was made much longer … this should help the annoying problem of the shaft not being center of the trigger and having to manually shift it center every time. I did think of completely changing the trigger to a DR trigger … but that looks like it is a very laborious process and not sure I would want to do that … to do it properly I would probably just have to make a completely new trigger for that one gun … maybe possible with 3 D printing but not worth the cost or the work … especially since the C4 is actually very nice and smooth and predictable.

Would be nice to see some feedback on this gun from someone who shoots it and tests it.
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Old 05-01-2020, 04:31 AM   #58
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New C4 Gladius speargun

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Originally Posted by spearq8 View Post

Would be nice to see some feedback on this gun from someone who shoots it and tests it.
Planning to do some pool testing once I got it. My main aim was to compare performance on band setup. I wonder how performance would be affected on a short gun like the 85 when you use 2xsmall id 14 mm or the standard 16 mm single band.
I need to see this up for the fastest reload possible so prefer to keep the single 16 mm I guess.

If I can shoot footage I will share it here.

And yes indeed that off center screw is certainly a design flaw. What the he’ll are they thinking?
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Old 05-01-2020, 04:40 AM   #59
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New C4 Gladius speargun

Apparently one of the reasons they moved away from mounting the bands higher up parallel to the shaft because it would cause less vibration of the bands when moving the gun. If that is the case i like it since it can make the difference in scaring away skittish fish or spearing them.

Last edited by kodama; 05-01-2020 at 10:32 AM.
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Old 05-01-2020, 03:20 PM   #60
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Re: New C4 Gladius speargun

The line release pivot is off center so that the entire rear of the shaft presses on the inner end of the lever and the lever's tip travel is greater because it is that much longer for the same travel arc. There are two holes to swap the lever from side to side by moving the pivot pin screw. What could be improved as no one uses spears with rear stop lugs on the tail is to reduce the width of the sear box mouth. Some spears have a rear transverse hole for a shooting line loop to sit in the sear box, but this is not preferable to a loop on the shaft tab or just forward of wishbone notches, hence the sides of the sear box should be moved inwards at the top to form more of a spear tail tunnel. Traditionally and from the beginning the eurogun had a rectangular sear box mouth to swallow the tail lugs, but that is no longer a requirement.

One benefit of rear tail line attachments was the spear could not T-bar when being dragged out of a cave with a reluctant passenger on board, but notched shafts could have the shaft tail snap clean off. Tabbed shafts usually don't have rear line mounting holes and tabbed shafts have no weak points to snap the tail off due to the absence of wishbone notches.
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