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All About Guns What's your weapon of choice, and why? Discuss the beloved speargun here!

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Old 09-28-2016, 02:34 PM   #1
popgun pete
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The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

I have written about this project elsewhere rather than bring it here to the “band gun world” as such, partly because I thought that it was an enterprise doomed to failure due to the technical mountains that had to be climbed and the resources required to pull it off.

The technology is summed up in these figures based on the patent and my own analysis of how the “Dreamair” gun was meant to work. I strongly doubted the advantages of three and four axle versions, but a single and a double made sense if it could all be made to work reliably and efficiency losses did not cripple it.

Now we knows that it works, what remains is how well and how reliably.

https://www.facebook.com/infinitengines/?fref=ts
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Last edited by popgun pete; 09-28-2016 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 09-28-2016, 02:49 PM   #2
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

The Omer "Airbalete" was intended to lure band gun users from the "band gun world", particularly "eurogun" users, to the "pneumatic gun world", but did not fully bridge the gap.

The "Dreamair" gun sits astride both worlds and as long as it works effectively, even if not efficiently, then it should be a very handy underwater weapon provided it does not cost a fortune to buy (it certainly will not be cheap) and users understand how it works by familiarising themselves with the instructions that will no doubt be supplied with each gun.
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Last edited by popgun pete; 09-28-2016 at 02:58 PM.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:51 AM   #3
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

Looks interesting ... any video of loading the gun and shooting it?
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Old 09-29-2016, 02:05 AM   #4
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

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Originally Posted by spearq8 View Post
Looks interesting ... any video of loading the gun and shooting it?
No videos listed at all, so unless an independent person put something up it will be first heralded on the site. Given only a few prototype guns exist I imagine their use is very tightly controlled, hence the inventor can release info as he wishes without spilling the beans on anything that may be a problem. I was hoping to see photos with the shooting line wraps deployed, but the gun is still cocked to shoot in all of these images. I don't see any holes in the target as the distant image of it is too small.
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Old 09-29-2016, 03:25 AM   #5
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

Just looking at the design ... I can see a lot of ways things can go wrong. This makes a double invert roller gun look simple. I just cannot see this thing as an effective hunting tool ... but they may have worked out all the problems. I feel speargun design is heading the wrong way ... nothing beats keeping things as simple as possible and as robust and reliable as possible. People still don't realize that they can get a huge boost in performance and accuracy by small changes in a classic speargun design.
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Old 09-29-2016, 05:23 AM   #6
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

The "nuts and bolts" of the gun are simpler than it looks, but to work properly everything has to be adjusted just right as the top deck wishbone draw length is dictated by the length of the wound spiral tracks on the outer drums which have to wind in synch from side to side. Lengthen the gun and those tracks and drums need to be elongated outwards to match the increased draw length.

Inside the gun another set of cables wind on a single drum inside the pressurized area, the spiral tracks here providing a variable leverage to the corresponding positions on the outer drums. The CVT aspect is to provide variable leverage as the drums wind to modify the load applied as the rate of winding increases or decreases. The speed does vary, but the prime aim is to change the load application profile during the band draw and vary it considerably from the usual loading procedure. Whether the task is made any easier is not the objective, rather it is that it can be done at all by the average spearfisherman who is not built like King Kong.

You really need to digest this analysis to see where the gun is coming from and heading to, however setting up and tuning will be important to making the gun work and producing the desired results on a continuing basis as any stretch and cable untracking will be the cause of lengthy repairs and increased gun downtime.

https://forums.deeperblue.com/thread...eargun.101674/
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Last edited by popgun pete; 10-12-2016 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 09-29-2016, 04:44 PM   #7
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

Here is one reason why the "Dreamair" gun will be expensive, note how the spiral track roller/drum is being machined. Could be a casting proposition using a lost wax process or equivalent, but the grooves have to be accurate and control the line as they push the line outwards as the drums wind them up during the shot.
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Last edited by popgun pete; 10-11-2016 at 03:11 PM.
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Old 10-12-2016, 10:36 AM   #8
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

An improved diagram for the twin axle version of the "Dreamair" gun.
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Old 10-12-2016, 07:38 PM   #9
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

im a chemical engineer and lost interest in the drawings. show me something that works in the real world or its scribble otherwise
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Old 10-12-2016, 10:07 PM   #10
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

Is this not "real world" enough? I can only show photos that are publicly available. Actually "rollers" is a misnomer as they are actually cable winding drums fixed to the axles so that everything rotates as a single unit.
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Last edited by popgun pete; 10-12-2016 at 10:22 PM.
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Old 10-13-2016, 03:05 AM   #11
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

It's roller with variable transmision rate. A little sophisticated Stefano Sorinanos mach control system publicated in 2011.
http://www.stefano-soriano.it/arbaff...=81&Itemid=600
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Old 10-13-2016, 05:00 AM   #12
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

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Originally Posted by gspearguns View Post
It's roller with variable transmision rate. A little sophisticated Stefano Sorinanos mach control system publicated in 2011.
http://www.stefano-soriano.it/arbaff...=81&Itemid=600
A roller turns on its fixed axle, these winding drums rotate with the axle which spins in the bearings mounted in the muzzle and the spiral track takes many turns around the surface of the drum, whereas a roller just has a single circumferential groove with flanges on either side, or multiples thereof if it is say a twin groove roller.

I read that reference, it is a totally different concept to the "Infintengines" gun. I suggest others do the same.
http://www.microsofttranslator.com/b...26Itemid%3D502
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Old 10-13-2016, 06:37 AM   #13
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

I wrote that this is sophisticated version of Stefano mach3 principle. Stefano change transmision rate by every rope layer on fixed diameter rolers and here that is done by drums with variable diamater at every rope circle. Several layers on Stefanos narrow drum has same effect as here on spiral drum.
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Old 10-13-2016, 10:25 AM   #14
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

Well without wishing to detract from that work, which perhaps you could create a separate thread for here and let it be discussed at length, the "Dreamair" gun uses the spiral to store the length of the cables that provide the draw on the top deck. If the gun was longer then the drums would need to be that much wider and thus have a longer groove or track for the extra cable length to sit in. Similarly the inner drum would need to be wider to hold the extra length of inner cable needed for a longer "barrel" or central stock which contains the pressure chamber. In one embodiment of the gun the drums are simply cylindrical, so the leverage stays the same and is dictated by the ratio of the drum sizes with respect to the inner drum and the outer drum diameters. For this reason "Dreamair" guns will probably only be available in one stock length initially which will be governed by the drum widths, although the length of track is greater if the drum is fatter over its width, which provides more groove length than if the drum rapidly tapered to a finer profile. However groove spacing is another factor as the grooves may not necessarily be tightly packed together, although a close grouping offers a more efficient use of the drum width. Hence cable accommodation, or storage space, in the track grooves on the drums is an important aspect of the design, and in a sense, is a limiting one.
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Old 10-13-2016, 11:13 AM   #15
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Re: The Infinite Engines Dreamair moves from dream to reality

No Pete, that was not my intention. I just want to say that idea of variable transmision was already presented.
This work deserve to admire it.
And I agree with you about dimensions of the gun.
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