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Old 09-05-2013, 10:17 AM   #61
makomike27
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

5 stages of loss and grief.

1. Denial and isolation

2. Anger

3. Bargaining

4. Depression

5. Acceptance

Sound like some people are not to stage 5 yet.

I cant speak about the situation as i was not there, but i can only speak about my experience with diving with Jimmy. He is regularly talking about safety and having a plan. I will continue to dive with him and learn from him.
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:30 AM   #62
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

Sure Jimmy you were on the boat, not sure how as you really were not welcome. The fact remains that a diver was left on the first dive of the day with no immediate attempt to rescue or retrieve him. Full tank of gas, 10 plus full dive tanks, plenty of bottom time.......just no excuse!

I can't tell you how many times Vince and I have geared up when a diver has extended his bottom time to ensure he is ok. I've dove the east coast commercially and recreationally for 15 years and never known anyone not to make every effort with available resources to recover or assist a missing diver. (Tony you should understand as you have been through this)

Never has the current been so bad we have not been able to dive. The current was bad when we recovered the body. Sad part is it took 6 minutes from the time Vince hit the water until he secured his body and equipment and returned to the surface. YES 6 minutes!!!!!!

I can never condone the actions played out by your Captain or you, especially you being a certified Dive master.

dbsalt......maybe you have a some insight you would like to share that may shed a different light on this tragic event.

-Mark Huffman
407-625-4492
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:47 AM   #63
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

No, I'm good. Won't be much longer and there will be plenty of insight as to what happened. Not mine to mention.

Just like the decisions made Monday weren't yours to make. Difference is you and Vince won't shut up about it.


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Old 09-05-2013, 11:12 AM   #64
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

"Just like the decisions made Monday weren't yours to make. Difference is you and Vince won't shut up about it. "



Difference is Vince & I went and recoved their diver!
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:17 PM   #65
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

Very tragic situation. Now as i try to figure this out, because it happened in our house. All i have is pieces of speculation on the episode. It might appear that ryan got knocked out,how? Whether by a big fish or a rear end of a gun.Thinking back on earlier post Jimmy almost got knocked out by a gun I hope and pray that he didnt loan that gun out to Ryan, I hope that this misfiring gun is in for repair or chop sawed.Just saying for safety sake lets help each other out double checking each others equipment. Nothing bad being intended towards anybody just trying to remind us.
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:23 PM   #66
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

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Everyone should wait for the autopsy results before conjecturing what happened.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seastalker View Post
Sure Jimmy you were on the boat, not sure how as you really were not welcome. The fact remains that a diver was left on the first dive of the day with no immediate attempt to rescue or retrieve him. Full tank of gas, 10 plus full dive tanks, plenty of bottom time.......just no excuse!

I can't tell you how many times Vince and I have geared up when a diver has extended his bottom time to ensure he is ok. I've dove the east coast commercially and recreationally for 15 years and never known anyone not to make every effort with available resources to recover or assist a missing diver. (Tony you should understand as you have been through this)

Never has the current been so bad we have not been able to dive. The current was bad when we recovered the body. Sad part is it took 6 minutes from the time Vince hit the water until he secured his body and equipment and returned to the surface. YES 6 minutes!!!!!!

I can never condone the actions played out by your Captain or you, especially you being a certified Dive master.

dbsalt......maybe you have a some insight you would like to share that may shed a different light on this tragic event.

-Mark Huffman
407-625-4492
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Originally Posted by seastalker View Post
"Just like the decisions made Monday weren't yours to make. Difference is you and Vince won't shut up about it. "



Difference is Vince & I went and recoved their diver!
Mark, as I stated by me above why not wait for the medical examiner and other authorities to do their work instead of second guessing?

Jimmy was on the recovery crew and should be thanked as much as you, Vince, TJ, and anyone else helping with recovery.

The normal protocol when a diver is late from a dive in a current and possibly on deco is to search on the surface. Doing an immediate dive could be an option, but again we were not there. Had the issue been entanglement and air supply was ok, then that might have helped. But again, we were not there and that may not have been the precipitating event leading to the cause of death. We should know more soon. Please be patient.

Also, everyone should stop the speculation and finger-pointing as it brings us all down. Let the family, friends and community grieve the loss of Ryan without the gossipy trash talking.

Thanks, Tony

Last edited by SpearMax; 09-05-2013 at 01:24 PM.
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:26 PM   #67
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Lightbulb Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

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Originally Posted by vertical limit View Post
Very tragic situation. Now as i try to figure this out, because it happened in our house. All i have is pieces of speculation on the episode. It might appear that ryan got knocked out,how? Whether by a big fish or a rear end of a gun.Thinking back on earlier post Jimmy almost got knocked out by a gun I hope and pray that he didnt loan that gun out to Ryan, I hope that this misfiring gun is in for repair or chop sawed.Just saying for safety sake lets help each other out double checking each others equipment. Nothing bad being intended towards anybody just trying to remind us.
Ryan had his own gun, not Jimmys. Again speculation is not wise.

Let the dive accident investigators do their job.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:05 PM   #68
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

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Originally Posted by seastalker View Post
"Just like the decisions made Monday weren't yours to make. Difference is you and Vince won't shut up about it. "



Difference is Vince & I went and recoved their diver!
I won't argue that. You all investing your time and gear the way you did to bring him back is immensely commendable. My hat is off to you guys, truly. I mean that. You don't need me to tell you how much this means to the family and the entire community here.

I just respect what Jimmy and Jeff are experiencing the guilt of the "what if's" that will haunt them for some time to come. Just no need for you guys to beat them up.

They drifted looking for a DECO diver near the surface under current (I would have done the same). Putting another diver in the water would only limit the boat's ability to traverse and search for a surfaced diver. Then, they were apparently not allowed back in the water at the direction of the CG. It's not for anyone to run them down. They lost a diver off their boat by no doing of their own - regardless of what could have been done (against CG direction and advisement) to perform a recovery dive that afternoon.

You and Vince and Mike are strong divers - we all know this. It was right for you all to hop in and bring him home.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:16 PM   #69
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

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Wow please please please tell me what i just read is not the truth . There were full tanks and no one went to save or look for him. Then what the hell is a dive master good for. Evidently not for saving a life and a excuse of too much current keeps you out of the water lessthan 30 miles out of ponce please save that for the judge because no diver i ever meet would give that excuse. So unprofessional and negligent
I think the normal thing to do is look for the diver on the surface and call coast Guard ! Why would u assume a experience diver was in trouble then add another diver in the mix . And what different does it make what someones certification level is , when they are diving recreational or commercial and not working as DM!! Shit so what your saying is I would be responsible for my buddies when I am out having fun because I am a Divemaster ! Not working just hunting ! Get real ! You are turning a unfortunate situation into finger pointing ! It could happen to anyone of us ! Rip Ryan . Sorry for everyone's lost
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:33 PM   #70
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

Very Sad to hear. Peace be with all involved - My condolences to family and friends.
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Old 09-05-2013, 01:44 PM   #71
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

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Ryan had his own gun, not Jimmys. Again speculation is not wise.

Let the dive accident investigators do their job.
Took a whole minute to fall on deaf ears.
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Old 09-05-2013, 02:58 PM   #72
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

RIP Ryan. Condolences to the family. Thank you for bringing him home.
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Old 09-05-2013, 03:09 PM   #73
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

Condolences to the family. Rest in peace Ryan!
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Old 09-05-2013, 06:01 PM   #74
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

If I were driving the boat and knew the diver, I would feel very bad. Very sad and just horrible. However, unless the lost diver was a novice, I would not feel guilty. He chose to dive solo.

Of course the boat is going to look for an over due diver on the surface or look for bubbles from a diver drifting off on deco.

By the time the lost diver is way over due and he has not been located on the surface.. He is dead.

The proper protocol is to search on the surface for a decent amount of time and when you feel that things may be creeping out of control, you call the USCG. You pray like hell that he floated off on the surface and is unharmed, but you also know that if he is diving a single scuba tank, and has not reached the surface by this time, then he is dead.


It is amazing to me, to think that people would point the finger at others on the boat for not trying to do a dive and rescue the diver. IF, the diver had been hopelessly tangled in a net or something and they sat on the boat above him doing nothing, watching a thin trail of un moving bubbles come to the surface for much, much longer than is to be expected... and they did not jump in on the bubbles and check the situation out, then maybe they could feel guilty.. but that is not what happened.

I am struggling here to come up with a possible scenario where you would assume the worst and start searching the bottom within the time period where recover of a person alive would be possible. I have been presented with the situation of an overdue diver, many, many times. We always look on the surface. Only once have I decided to do a dive and before we splashed, I remember telling everyone that I am NOT doing CPR on a dead guy. We recovered him relatively quickly.

We owe it to the family of the diver to explain to them that he was diving alone and it is almost unimaginable to come up with a scenario where any one else's actions would have changed the outcome.

I heard he was recovered with 1000 psi in his tank.. What does that mean? It means that if the other divers assumed he would use his whole tank, then by the time he was even beginning to be over due, he had probably been dead for 10 minutes (and was therefore beyond help).
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Old 09-05-2013, 07:07 PM   #75
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Re: Coast Guard searches for missing diver off Ponce Inlet

Guys this is not about ego and never was.. If u want to dive On anyone's boat please go and experience the greatness but know as we all do this is dangerous and things can happen..but Ryan"s death was tragic and very sad i feel this deeply and I'm not beating my chest i did the right thing for me him and was trying only to help to recover him.. and by the way this is about his death not about who recovered him . i helped only...But as human we have a moral code to help the people in need .. Would you want your child, sibling , a loved one left alone. We all have a code .. The question here really is what is yours and what would you want for you and your loved ones... I know I may have sounded accusatory and I won't apologize for respecting the human life and what's the right thing to do for me ..I fall asleep at nite knowing I,was right ... Not only for me, my crew but but Ryan and his family. I am done ...rest in peace Ryan ...
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