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California Fisheries Regulations and Science (MLPA & MPA) Here is a dedicated forum for the extremely important MLPA & MPA process

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Old 10-29-2012, 01:37 PM   #1
Brandi
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2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Hi Divers,

I am strongly encouraging you to either attend or tune in via webcast http://www.fgc.ca.gov/meetings/FGCme...ideolinks.aspx to the Fish & Game Commission meeting to be held in Los Angeles November 7th to hear the discussions on agenda items pertaining to 2013 fishing and 2014 abalone regulations.

Please take particular note to item #5 regarding the Abalone Recovery Management Plan (ARMP) and its related link to learn first hand, whether you agree or not, the rationale behind the options to be proposed for 2014 abalone regulations. I will suggest that you specifically read chapters 5 and 7 of the ARMP as these will be the primary chapters to be discussed. Chapter 5 provides the overview of our management approach under the ARMP and chapter 7 details the management of the northern California fishery as well as future fisheries that may open.

Safe diving,
Brandi

Info on ARMP
http://www.dfg.ca.gov/marine/armp/index.asp

Agenda pdf for November 7th meeting can be found

http://www.fgc.ca.gov/meetings/2012/
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Old 10-30-2012, 12:48 PM   #2
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Thanks Brandi for the heads up. It's just typical of the DFG to have a meeting far away as possible from the majority of the Abalone divers who this would effect. I'm disscussed with these idiots.

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Old 10-31-2012, 02:07 AM   #3
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Wow, that's disturbing.

Simple summary of Chap 5:

MPAs are easy to enforce because anyone fishing there for anything will be cited/arrested. Simply having a moratorium on a single species (like abalone) will not work, the entire area needs to be shut down.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:51 AM   #4
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by chowderpuff View Post
Wow, that's disturbing.

Simple summary of Chap 5:

MPAs are easy to enforce because anyone fishing there for anything will be cited/arrested. Simply having a moratorium on a single species (like abalone) will not work, the entire area needs to be shut down.
And thats whats going to happen.
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Old 12-28-2012, 06:11 PM   #5
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Unless you have tribal ID card and then it you are good to go anywhere you want on the north coast
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Old 01-03-2013, 09:47 AM   #6
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

I do not know what the Department will be proposing yet but I do see abalone on the proposed rulemaking calendar here: http://www.fgc.ca.gov/regulations/20...rycalendar.pdf

It is interesting that the item states "Abalone Catch Reduction" the meeting to go to notice is in Mt. Shasta discussion in Santa Rosa and Adoption in Sacramento.
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:27 PM   #7
Brandi
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigfishhunter View Post
Unless you have tribal ID card and then it you are good to go anywhere you want on the north coast
Incorrect.

Having a tribal card does not give one a free pass 'anywhere on the north coast'. Even for those tribes who have exemptions, take allowances and gear types are specific to those tribes for their gathering and traditional practices in State Marine Conservation Areas (SMCA), nothing can be harvested in State Marine Reserves (SMR). Each SMCA indicates which tribe has exemptions within a Marine Protected Area, see (MPA) dropdown menus

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/mlpa/ncmpas_list.asp
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:28 PM   #8
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJoe View Post
I do not know what the Department will be proposing yet but I do see abalone on the proposed rulemaking calendar here: http://www.fgc.ca.gov/regulations/20...rycalendar.pdf

It is interesting that the item states "Abalone Catch Reduction" the meeting to go to notice is in Mt. Shasta discussion in Santa Rosa and Adoption in Sacramento.
Thank you BigJoe for the FYI and hope interested parties will be able to attend.
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Old 01-31-2013, 12:03 PM   #9
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

FYI divers. Deadline Feb 28 if you wish to fill out the survey.

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/marine/abalonesurvey/
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Old 02-20-2013, 03:22 PM   #10
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

It is not often I drive more than 7 hours round trip for a two hour meeting nor is it often I go to Fort Bragg without dive gear. Yesterday, I did both to join 5 other community members, 3 wardens and 3 biologists to discuss abalone regulation reduction options. It was an excellent meeting with good dialogue. Whether you agree or not with the science, how data is collected or the ARMP, these are the perimeters the biologists and Commissioners need to adhere to with the current ARMP. After considering all concerned (abalone fishery and abalone report card holders local and afar), economic impacts and input many of you have voiced, the majority consensus was the 8am start time was more preferential of the options presented.

I asked Ian T if the Fort Ross closure (their documentation indicated would represent 10% reduction) is a % of the 25% reduction goal (answer: yes) and if the 8am start time (their documentation indicated would represent 19% reduction) moves forward, if the combined would satisfy the 25% reduction stipulated by the ARMP ( ~29% total). Answer - yes. However, that may not address Somona County pressure concerns.

Other options suggested by attendees to consider beyond what the biologists have put forward were:

2/day, 24/year, 2 limit possession (this still needs further consideration of feasibility), gifting still allowed but only limited to one limit per person, (meaning spouse could only receive one limit not two, but the child could receive one limit - four days of diving 8 abs and still compliant no gifting notes required as info is on tag.

Considering Sonoma County impacts, Warden McKiver suggested a two report card concept keeping the 3/day and 24/year allowances with option to buy one or both cards. First card purchased would have 12 tags for abalone take in all North Coast counties (Marin, Sonoma, Mendo, Humboldt, Del Norte) with a hypothetical purchase cost of $15. Second report card would have 12 tags for abalone take in location codes Mendocino Co and north only with a hypothetical purchase cost of $20. Yes, that would mean the combo price of $35 - no discounts for buying both. He finalized his suggestion with 'if you loose your card, NO replacement'. This suggestion seemed to have some positive reception, including the biologists.

Other items discussed:
Poaching - still a huge concern, unknown impacts to fishery
Enforcement - there are open positions in the Ft Bragg area if anyone is interested in training to become a Warden
MPA options
Season closures - we all seemed to agree that this action would be futile as people would potentially shift their diving/rocking picking to open months, negating impact reduction
Effort shift
timeline for abalone regulation
ALDS info: as reported by biologist Jerry K, 31,000 report cards purchased and 214,000 abalone reported taken in 2011 (avg 6.9 abalone per person) and 29,000 report cards purchased in 2012. They are still receiving report cards so unable to report on abalone reported taken in 2012 yet.

Without ranting and verbose diatribes, what is your constructive input on:

views on the DFW biologists options (see survey http://cdfgnews.wordpress.com/2013/0...e-regulations/ )
thoughts on the 2/day, 2 limit possession
thoughts on the 2 report card concept, keeping in mind your own personal annual average take
Other ideas your can recommend to the biologists to recommend to the Commissioners at the March 6-7 Commission in Shasta to reach the 25% reduction

Finally, once the ISOR is filed late April, no changes can be made to options presented.

Thanks everyone
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Old 03-02-2013, 03:23 AM   #11
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Awesome report Brandi! Thanks for all the great information and for taking the time to go down and represent all of our interests.

In regards to the limit and card change propositions:

Speaking solely for myself, I like the two-card option. It would allow more flexibility for the future in case other counties were in need of greater protection. And it would help Sonoma in the near term. I also very rarely need more than two abalone to be happy for months. So the 2/day limit would not impact my own plans. If it was a choice between the two, I would have a stronger preference for the two-card option.

As for poaching. . . It is a fact that poaching of many species is a major problem. There are way too few wardens, and the areas that they are responsible for monitoring are incredibly large. We really need to step up our community's efforts to keep an eye out and report poachers to the DFG. Toll free number 888-334-2258.

Keep up the good work, and thanks again,

Galen
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Old 03-02-2013, 02:38 PM   #12
Brandi
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Thanks Galen. I think it would be important for you/all concerned to directly convey your thoughts to FGC

Verbally:
Santa Rosa April 17-18 (agenda posted 10 days before meeting)
Flamingo Conference Resort & Spa
2777 Fourth Street
Santa Rosa, CA

email: fgc@fgc.ca.gov

Written comments:

California Fish and Game Commission
P.O. Box 944209
Sacramento, CA 94244-2090

and/or

Fish & Game Commission
1416 Ninth, Room 1320
Sacramento, CA 95814


All,
repost from http://norcalunderwaterhunters.com/f...;topicseen#new reply #10

"April Commission meeting will be important. This Santa Rosa meeting is where the Department will formally float their prefered approach to reducing catch. This meeting is where the Commission will decide to accept or modify their proposal based on alternatives they might get from the public. Remember that the Commissions job is to balance between what the science calls for and what the public will tolerate..."

Safe diving
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Last edited by Brandi; 03-07-2013 at 02:32 PM.
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Old 03-08-2013, 05:22 PM   #13
dirkbeachman
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Brandi,
I appreciate you representing us. I've been a long time north coast ab diver. I will send my comments to the address in one of your last posts. My couple of suggestions are: 1) If we need reduce the catch, instead of reducing the number per day, and wasting so much gas, camping expenses, etc, to catch only 2 abs, why not put the catch per day back at 4/day and reduce the total number to 16 per season and reduce the license fee accordingly? Personally, I would rather go fewer times, but be able to catch enough to justify greater than $4/gal gas while having (hopefully) enough catch to have a great dinner feast when I get back. 2) Encourage DFG employees (rangers) to treat sport divers politely and respectively, not like the enemy. The divers I know buy licenses, don't abuse the resourse or environment, yet sometimes get virtually interrogated, searched, and treated with suspicion. We are the solution, NOT the problem. 3) Get some divers involved with the design of the ab cards- the current things are such a pain to anyone with cold, wet fingers- they clearly were designed by some non-diver sitting in an office, not on a rocky coast.
Thanks again!
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Old 03-08-2013, 07:08 PM   #14
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Quote:
Originally Posted by dirkbeachman View Post
Brandi,
I appreciate you representing us. I've been a long time north coast ab diver. I will send my comments to the address in one of your last posts. My couple of suggestions are: 1) If we need reduce the catch, instead of reducing the number per day, and wasting so much gas, camping expenses, etc, to catch only 2 abs, why not put the catch per day back at 4/day and reduce the total number to 16 per season and reduce the license fee accordingly? Personally, I would rather go fewer times, but be able to catch enough to justify greater than $4/gal gas while having (hopefully) enough catch to have a great dinner feast when I get back. 2) Encourage DFG employees (rangers) to treat sport divers politely and respectively, not like the enemy. The divers I know buy licenses, don't abuse the resourse or environment, yet sometimes get virtually interrogated, searched, and treated with suspicion. We are the solution, NOT the problem. 3) Get some divers involved with the design of the ab cards- the current things are such a pain to anyone with cold, wet fingers- they clearly were designed by some non-diver sitting in an office, not on a rocky coast.
Thanks again!
Thank you dirkbeachman

In response:
1) the idea was proposed for a reduction in daily take with the allowance of a two day possession. You are only the second person I am aware of who has indicated that preference - but this is an alternate option posed by a diver, not the DFW so not sure if its a viable option - yet.
2) I agree, compliant license holders are not the problem. If you have had a problem with a particular warden who was not professional, please let DFW know.
3) There are quite a few divers discussing card designs, but more so for possible changes in the regulations. Plus, we are currently limited to the ALDS printout system. To do some other kind of tagging method, cost, fabrication, distribution and ease of the user are things to consider. Do you have card ideas you would like to share with DFW?
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Old 03-11-2013, 01:38 PM   #15
dirkbeachman
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Re: 2014 abalone regulation recommendations

Brandi,
Again thanks for your thoughtful representation of sport diving. I think if the DFG really wants some feedback from the diving community, they should do a survey. They have our contact info from licenses. That way they could first present the situation as they see it so we could understand whether and how much reduction may be needed. Then they could include some options. People often respond better to choices rather that coming up with proposals themselves. So, for instance, if a choice was to cut license fee by 60% but also return to the 4 abalone/day limit, it might turn out to be a popular choice (I'm not saying it would win) while people asked just to make up proposals might not think of that permutation.

On the physical licenses themselves, I am not sure of the limitations of the printers. I would propose at the least that the individual tags be perforated, but even better would be to return to just a report card, and doing away with tagging individual abalone. Again, I feel like the sport diving community are honorable and can be trusted, why not let us record our take like we used to? We are not the abusers of the resourse, I don't believe.

On the wardens, again my comment was intended as a general change in attitude. It could be that any position of authority, by it's very nature, can lead to abuse. (Reference also the famous Zimbardo prison pyschology experiment). If the DFG does do a survey, that would be a great opportunity to find out if there is a widespread dissatisfaction with the way the regulations are enforced.
Thanks!
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