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Old 05-13-2018, 05:23 AM   #1
tottenham
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Salvimar Hero

Anyone tested this gun. Looks the goods with the high handle and palm insert and super strong rollered trigger.?
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Old 05-14-2018, 03:34 AM   #2
spearq8
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Re: Salvimar Hero

I had a look at one of those guns yesterday and I might buy one and test it out. They look really nice! One thing I found concerning was that when I calipered the front roller it was only 3.5mm !!! In testing the Ermessub roller we had issues with thin rollers even at 4.5mm as they would dig in and deform the trigger sear. Obviously in that test the loads were extremely high over 500 shots ... and this might not be an issue if you only use 2 bands. But with the Ermessub double roller the roller ended up being 4.8mm ... and a few high end rollers made for very high loads using CNC machined sears going as high as 5.9mm wide !!!

Anyway the gun certainly has me interested enough to buy it and give it a test in the pool.
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Old 05-14-2018, 08:05 AM   #3
Diving Gecko
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Sounds good!
There's a fair bit of old hate for Salvimar's pipe guns in the archives here. I speculate, most of it from when they just launched and then since, no one has really uttered a word. Would be nice to see it taken through its paces:-)
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Old 05-14-2018, 09:30 AM   #4
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Re: Salvimar Hero

I saw some YouTube videos of some guy hunting with it using 3 bands. The muzzle ramps seem to do a nice job of keeping the bands nice and parallel to the shaft. Reminded me of abellan. Recoil didn't seem too bad either. Interested to see how it does in a controlled setting.

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Old 05-14-2018, 10:41 AM   #5
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Re: Salvimar Hero

This gun has been on my radar for a while now. Would love to see some test results!


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Old 05-22-2018, 08:16 PM   #6
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Iím real interested in this gun. Any reviews would be greatly appreciated.
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Old 05-23-2018, 12:55 AM   #7
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Re: Salvimar Hero

The local dealer did not have any full guns, but he did have some handles with the roller trigger. I bought a couple of them to try and see if they would fit on a Pathos gun. Guess what ... it is a totally perfect match ... I mean the handle fit in and the track height lined up millimeter perfect. I have a Pathos 120 that I setup with this new handle and will give it a try today in the pool.

The roller actually turns out to be around 2.5mm according to the guy Salvimar sales guy (still haven't taken it apart to put a direct caliper on it). That is way too thin IMHO, but maybe with 2 bands it is not a problem. They could have easily made the roller 5mm or even 5.5mm as there is plenty of unused real estate. Also both sears are MIM (metal injection molded) ... I mean that gives you so much design flexibility that again ... easily could have increased the roller size. Anyway this gun is designed for a max of 2 bands so really can' fault Salvimar for designing within their envelope. I also am worried about the line release as it doesn't seem to fully open up ... hopefully that doesn't snag the line a little as it releases, as in my experience this little detail kills high accuracy. If it does then maybe should put something to move the line off to the side and reduce the chances of a snag. The handle is also quite heavy ... but that is not necessarily a bad thing as it is extremely solid. The handle is way better than the Pathos handle in feel and just oozes high quality, but maybe need to check the ballast and might have to add additional flotation to get good balance on the Pathos. I have to say I have good vibes about this! This might be a fantastic mod for anyone with a Pathos speargun. The price is very reasonable as well as I got the full handle with trigger for a discounted $60.
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Old 05-23-2018, 02:59 AM   #8
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Re: Salvimar Hero

As for the plastic that mirrors my own observation with the handle and muzzle on their Predathor air gun. I speculate the might use a plastic with a lot of fiber mixed in. It certainly feels strong and the mold parting lines and injection dimples are minimal, too. Just looks and feels well made.


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Old 05-23-2018, 07:19 AM   #9
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Spearq8, please let us know how it went, will you post a video?
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Old 05-23-2018, 01:17 PM   #10
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Well I did try the trigger out in the pool … and unfortunately results were terrible. Initially I thought that there was a problem where the safety was getting stuck somehow, but then I realized that the trigger pull was just too damn hard. I mean so hard to pull that you need two hands to be able to pull a shot off. My brother also tried a shot and also thought the safety was somehow slipping in there with similar results. I figured it must be a defective trigger and pulled out the other one I had. But again the same. This was on a Pathos 120 gun with 2 x 14 mm bands and a 7mm shaft … hardly a super high power setup. Maybe I have my bands setup up too tight … but still I was totally disappointed. Not sure what the problem is as the sears seem to work perfectly out of the water in dry firing. It is possible that it is because I use a bungee on the line release to keep my stiff spectra tight (to prevent band tangles) … so maybe you cannot use a bungee with this trigger. Or maybe there is just something wrong going on with the geometry of the trigger movement. I need to pull it apart and take a look inside. It is also possible that there is a compatibility issue with the Pathos barrel that I have not noticed (but hard to see that as something relevant as the fit is millimeter perfect and the handle and trigger are one unit). I am quite surprised that nobody else seems to be having problems with this trigger as I haven't heard anything about this from other people. On the Salvimar advertising they mention that the trigger pull at 100KG load was .6kg … there is no way in hell the trigger pull was .6kg … if I would estimate I would guess it is at least 20 x that on the two triggers I tested.

I got very close to buying the entire lot of handles with triggers from the local dealer. This would have saved me the headache of producing the small amount of triggers for the Pathos guns I have planned for my buddies here. Would be interested in opinions of anyone else that has tried this trigger.
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Old 05-28-2018, 04:17 PM   #11
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Re: Salvimar Hero

So that means the new series metal trigger from Salvimar is still s#@%?
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Old 05-29-2018, 02:30 AM   #12
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Re: Salvimar Hero

I pulled out the parts and scanned them and put them on the computer to simulate the trigger action and try and figure out what the problem is. I think Salvimar went out of their way to make sure all the parts used were top notch and to be honest the quality of the materials used was excellent. Unfortunately the design they did and the production trigger are probably not the same. Most likely someone other than the original designer decided he needed to add a bunch of tolerances in there and that totally screwed up how the trigger works. You just can't do that with a roller trigger as it doesn't work like a friction trigger. This trigger needs a couple of revisions to get it to work like the original designer intended it work. They need to field test the production trigger and put it through a battery of high stress multiple shots and look at the wear signals on the parts. It doesn't help that the roller used is only 2.8mm wide … that really leaves very little margin for error … but if they are designing for only 2 bands it might still work.

Having said that, I got a third trigger and this time I removed the safety. I also reduced to a lower powered 350% stretch 2 x 14mm bands, and this time I did manage to get the gun to shoot about 10 shots. It still was way more trigger pull effort than any other trigger I have used, but at least I was able to get acceptable groupings. Compared to say a Riffe Euro trigger, it was taking about 4x the force needed to pull the trigger. For a roller trigger it should be equal if not less force required ... especially with such a reduced band load. Not sure if it was the removal of the safety that helped … or the reduction in band load. Salvimar needs to get back on the drawing board for this one and revise their design.
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Old 05-29-2018, 10:29 AM   #13
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Quote:
Originally Posted by spearq8 View Post
The local dealer did not have any full guns, but he did have some handles with the roller trigger. I bought a couple of them to try and see if they would fit on a Pathos gun. Guess what ... it is a totally perfect match ... I mean the handle fit in and the track height lined up millimeter perfect. I have a Pathos 120 that I setup with this new handle and will give it a try today in the pool.

The roller actually turns out to be around 2.5mm according to the guy Salvimar sales guy (still haven't taken it apart to put a direct caliper on it). That is way too thin IMHO, but maybe with 2 bands it is not a problem. They could have easily made the roller 5mm or even 5.5mm as there is plenty of unused real estate. Also both sears are MIM (metal injection molded) ... I mean that gives you so much design flexibility that again ... easily could have increased the roller size. Anyway this gun is designed for a max of 2 bands so really can' fault Salvimar for designing within their envelope. I also am worried about the line release as it doesn't seem to fully open up ... hopefully that doesn't snag the line a little as it releases, as in my experience this little detail kills high accuracy. If it does then maybe should put something to move the line off to the side and reduce the chances of a snag. The handle is also quite heavy ... but that is not necessarily a bad thing as it is extremely solid. The handle is way better than the Pathos handle in feel and just oozes high quality, but maybe need to check the ballast and might have to add additional flotation to get good balance on the Pathos. I have to say I have good vibes about this! This might be a fantastic mod for anyone with a Pathos speargun. The price is very reasonable as well as I got the full handle with trigger for a discounted $60.
Salvimar Hero's handle doesn't fit any other barrell as it is oval shaped. You probaly got a different/previous version one.
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Last edited by Marco; 05-29-2018 at 11:08 AM.
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Old 05-29-2018, 10:34 AM   #14
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Re: Salvimar Hero

A friend of mine here in Panama has one and he swears for that gun. What he likes most is exactly how smooth ans short the trigger pull is... He's using it with the standard setting (2 x 16 mm bands).
What he likes less is how it moves in the water. But it is logical with a gun shaped like it.

There should be something wrong with your tests.
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Old 05-30-2018, 02:20 AM   #15
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Re: Salvimar Hero

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco View Post
A friend of mine here in Panama has one and he swears for that gun. What he likes most is exactly how smooth ans short the trigger pull is... He's using it with the standard setting (2 x 16 mm bands).
What he likes less is how it moves in the water. But it is logical with a gun shaped like it.

There should be something wrong with your tests.
Actually you have a good point ... I looked carefully at pictures of the Salvimar Hero handle and the roller trigger does look different to the roller trigger on the Salvimar Metal handle. The roller seems much wider and most likely the errors in the older Salvimar Metal roller trigger were fixed. It is strange why they would have 2 different roller triggers as the cost of doing both triggers would be the same. What I can say without a doubt is that the Salvimar Metal handle roller trigger is just not usable. I can say this with 100% confidence because I actually have the parts in a 3D simulation of the trigger in action ... and let's just say there are at least 5 major problems that need to be fixed. It turns out that the safety is not the problem, but rather that the "good" trigger just had the tolerances working in its favor. But today I opened up the "good" trigger out of the 3 I have in which I managed to get 10 shots off with 2 x 14mm bands at 350%, and even with this low power load and very few shots, the trigger sear was already getting torn up. Here are two pictures of the trigger sear after those shots. You can clearly see the indentation the roller put on the trigger sear ... and this after only 10 shots using a relatively weak band load. On the second picture you can actually see the marks made by the shaft sear arms holding the roller ... so this is basically working as a crude friction trigger !!! This actually matches exactly with the 3D computer simulation I made. The roller on the shaft sear also had damage ... this is just not usable. How Salvimar can release something like this for sale is just not understandable. This does not mean that the Salvimar Hero trigger also has these problems as from the pictures the trigger does look different. I will try to get a Salvimar Hero this summer when I go to europe for summer vacation.



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