100 Ways for a Rig Diver to Die

[Louis Rossignol]

Can't give you any good advise there, "Shoot and Pray", that's what riding rigs are for, you can always let go.

Several techniques seariously,

Stone em right at the top of the gill plate,

Shoot them and then grab both ends of the shaft and rodeo their asses to the surface, that was Whip's strategy, unfortunately he isnt here anymore

Shoot them and let them wrap up on the rig and then stab them out with your knife, hand to hand combat, definately the most dangerous way

My preferred way now, since I'm an old fart, I like to shoot them around the pipes and let them knock themselves silly for a few minutes, all the while inflating my BC till the thing is belching air, then all in one motion, kick off the rig to the surface and don't look back.

Hope that helps but every fight is unique, you only do what you have to do, remember, "War is a Fluid Situation".

[Dudro612]

So Rok you guys only shoot one big fish a dive seems like thats the only way to do it if you arent grabbin the fish?

[FredT]

A single large fish is the general rule. If snapper or ling are up shallow it may be possible to get 2 or more. Generally its bounce to 100, see what's under you on one or two breaths, then a single breath to dive to the fish and make the shot. Inhale on the shot and head up reasonably fast.

I prefer Louis's methods one and three, but I generally throat to bleed the fish out once it's tied itself firmly to the rig instead of stab for the brain. That is easier to do from '"outside the loop" as no bone is involved.

Method 2 can get you hurt pretty bad if Mother Ocean is hungry.
FT

[Teh Wicked]

Really good information on this thread...

Fl guys should be reading this and learning, seeing as how we will prolly have rigs in the not so distant future no that offshore drilling has been approved by Bush.

[Louis Rossignol]

Originally Posted by Dudro612

So Rok you guys only shoot one big fish a dive seems like thats the only way to do it if you arent grabbin the fish?

I am a competition spearfisherman, I only shoot the fish if it's going to be at least 1st or 2nd on the boat. I don't shoot for meat, but after a day of diving I have enough incidental by-catch to feed an army.

Another tip is, when stabbing out a big AJ, when you smack him right through the gill plate with your knife and he quits moving, don't take the knife out till you hit the surface. I've had many fish gaffed that still had my knife in the side of their head.

[Wooley]

I have been gripped by this thread since I first discovered it. I have read each response carefully and have been left in disbelief by some of the stories.

I have come to the conclusion that the Hell Divers daily diet consists of Gun Powder and complete insanity.

To be honest Rok, I am really, REALLY surprised you are still alive after hearing all of your stories.

KEEP THE STORIES COMING!!!!!

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by Louis Rossignol

Shoot them and let them wrap up on the rig and then stab them out with your knife, hand to hand combat, definately the most dangerous way

I killed my first AJ last weekend. It was very small by your standards, 33.6#, but I'm still learning...I'd rather kill a few in the 30#'s than get killed by one in the 80#'s.

I shot him just behind the eye..he crumpled and I thought, "Man, this was easy!" then all hell broke loose. He was just stunned. I dragged him over to the rig somehow and tied him off with the riding rig and fought him there. Tried to tire him out (stupid) then pulled my knife to try to stick him in the base of the skull...wound up killing him by cutting out his gills...it was amazing how he almost immediately lost strength when I made my first cut.

Lessons learned (If anyone disagrees with the lessons learned, please point out my error...):

--When the fish is temporarily stunned, tie him off to the rig

--go up to 50-60' to conserve air and bottom time while you let him thrash.

--It is a waste of time and air to fight the fish on the rig. He'll either die or he'll pull off the spear (it is nice to have a slip tip so he doesn't bend your shaft).

--I was glad I had a hang tank at 40'. I felt like I was in a wrestling match and burned up a tank pretty quick - 2600# in 20 minutes (much at 100', but still...)

--Bring an extra gun down with you, tie it off at 40'. This will give you something to do while you wait for the first fish to die.

I'm still not comfortable doing bounce dives like the Helldivers do...it's completely different to everything I was taught about slow ascents. This may keep me from ever getting the REALLY big fish if they are at 220'+, like Wil said, you don't have time to screw around going to that depth.

This is in no way intended to be a criticism of the Helldivers...they have the experience to do it thousands of times a year safely. I'm also not comfortable riding a fast motorcycle, flying fast jets, or working as a cop in a big city. Take your pick, it's hard to tell the difference between lack of balls and maturely knowing your limits (and limits change as you get experience/get older).

I'm cool with that...the conservative John Galt will be spearing 30# fish years after the aggressive John Galt was killed by an 80#'er. You can probably get away with blowing through your limits if you have a high level of fitness or high level of experience. I have neither at this time.

[bottomnout]

John you are kind of scarin me man. Tyin off tanks and guns? Don't make this more complicated than it is. There are only a few reasons to ever have to use hand to fin combat, and your situation was not one of them. Just calm down, control your beathing and let the fish beat its self against a pipe or just hang on to a pipe until he calms down. A 30# aj will kill you just as fast as a 80#. Keep it simple, DO NOT RELY ON BACK UP AIR, that will definitely get you ass in a bad situation. Don't hang a gun, good way to loose your shit. And don't camp out, 20 min is a long time to be messin around on a rig, also I'm telling you all this stuff, not to be a dick, but to save your life.

[John Galt]

Originally Posted by bottomnout

John you are kind of scarin me man. Tyin off tanks and guns? Don't make this more complicated than it is. There are only a few reasons to ever have to use hand to fin combat, and your situation was not one of them. Just calm down, control your beathing and let the fish beat its self against a pipe or just hang on to a pipe until he calms down. A 30# aj will kill you just as fast as a 80#. Keep it simple, DO NOT RELY ON BACK UP AIR, that will definitely get you ass in a bad situation. Don't hang a gun, good way to loose your shit. And don't camp out, 20 min is a long time to be messin around on a rig, also I'm telling you all this stuff, not to be a dick, but to save your life.

Thanks for the advice...you're not being a dick at all.

I had an instructor tell me that he hangs an extra gun for tournaments.....but if that's a bad idea, I'll skip it next time. I did it on one drop and didn't use it. Nobody home.

[Scubaru]

John I was hopin you and Mike would realize how bulky and un-KISS the hang tank and extra gun would be. A big fish (maybe even a green fish), a stage tank, and 2 guns is a PITA to come back to the boat with. Remember the cluster the AJ made just out of your riding rig and stringer? There was rope, cable, slip tip, gun, and stringer everywhere in a 9 line bind. That's the kind of deal that will get you into trouble around Mr Murphy on the rig legs!

[elCajuna Grande]

A 30# aj will kill you just as fast as a 80#.

well, maybe not as fast but, dead is dead
good post Jon

[Scubaru]

Originally Posted by Louis Rossignol

Let's talk about speech!!!

Ya know me and Papa Smurf talk underwater. I can legibaly understand what he is saying and he can understand me.

Thats freakin amazing. I can barely understand you on the telephone!

[Louis Rossignol]

John, on the AJ issue,

when you shot that fish did he start pumping his gills and opening his mouth? If he did all he was doing was cranking up the turbo-chargers. When they start that, you need to make a move fast.

On 30lbers. your best bet is not to ever touch the fish. They can mess your world up faster than a big fish because they are faster. In no time at all they will knock your mask off and pull your regulator out of your mouth. Best bet is to just drag up the fish, kick your ass off to the surface.

Also, you have that hang tank, right?

What do you do when you absolutely need it in a desperate way and it's not there for some reason or another?

You cannot depend on anything you don't bring with you. Keep it simple.

Spare air, another crutch, what happens when you absolutely need it, and for some reason it's empty?

The best thing you did in your whole dive was bring the fish up several feet before battling with him. Other than that, the hand to hand combat is not the thing to do.

Here's another theory of mine, if I only have an 80cu. ft. tank, I barely have enough air to get bent.

AJ's aren't the only fish out there but they are one of the most challenging, try shooting them commercially when there weren't any limits.

I was sitting on a pipe stringing up 50lbers. back in the day, no limits. I'd shoot one, stab him out and string him up, all at only 80ft. On the third one, I reach back to stab him in the head and another one in the school swallows my arm all the way up to the elbow. That was interesting!

Here's another cool story,

Me, Duey Haggman and Jay Myers are going to South Pass 93, 400' of water. Duey's telling me on the way out, he going to shoot a 25lb. red snapper. I tell him he's full of "S". The water is too deep for red snappers.

We head down, at 180' Jay shoots a 40lb. AJ and Duey finds a frigging 25lb. red snapper, I was amazed, well all of a sudden this big fish from the depths comes up, a, 100lb. AJ. The fish bum rushes Duey's red snapper and grabs it in his mouth, he has it half way down and Duey is yelling at me to get over there. I watch the fish spit the snapper out only to get a better bite and he's really in control of the snapper now. I come haulin ass over there and when I get on top of the AJ, I notice his eye roll around and look right at me. I let him have it, right on top of the gill plate. I looked around and there was nothing to grab onto. The fish's tail went up and his head straight down. I'm holding the riding rig with both hands waiting for the ass kicking I'm about to receive. Then some bubbles come out of the AJ's mouth and he never moved.

Wow, I slapped that "Bad Boy" 99-12 on the boat before anyone could ever hit the surface.

[Mobile Diver]

I had a rig AJ try to take an ARS off my stringer also. I think of that anytime some sh*thead like Rene Rice claims divers shut down a jack bite.

[John Galt]

Thanks for the advice. I hope I haven't scared all you guys from ever diving with me.

I'll ixnay on the hang tank and gun in the future. Like I said, did it one only one of the three dives I did last weekend...

Louis, the one thing I'm still having trouble wrapping my head around is dropping to the deep, shooting, power inflating, and then popping out at the surface like a Polaris missle? Did I understand that right? I've always done nice, slow ascents and long safety stops?